Idling a car?? Whats everyones methods??

[AAXR8]

Hi, I was told by a neighbour that idling cars was not a good thing??
I was told different that you should warn your car up minimum 3 mins,
So as you can see we have a great to and throw conversation over the fence!!But can you idle a car for to long? What would be the Maximum you could idle a car for?? Or it dosn't matter as long as it does not over heat or any other problem etc?

[Peter B - CV8]

On a modern (fuel injected) car there's no need or benefit in a prolonged idle time. I just fire her up, wait approx 10 seconds (for the idle to settle & diagnostics to clear) & then hit the road - taking it easy until it's warmed up.

[tut0r]

According to the booklet for my BF falcon, it says let the car warm up for at least 30 seconds before driving, probably to allow oil to filter through everywhere and lubricate.

[Franco Cozzo]

When I was leaving for work in the mornings I let it idle 15 mins before I got in to drive, mainly to heat up the car cause it was always under 10 degrees in the mornings here or to melt ice off the thing.

Or it was hot in summer so the A/C would be going for 10-15 to cool it down before I got into drive.

If it was my WS Fiesta I'd start it 30 minutes early before I left work during clean up time then go back in to work and let it idle with the A/C going in the car park because it sucked hardcore on any day over 25.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

When I was leaving for work in the mornings I let it idle 15 mins before I got in to drive, mainly to heat up the car cause it was always under 10 degrees in the mornings here or to melt ice off the thing.

Or it was hot in summer so the A/C would be going for 10-15 to cool it down before I got into drive.

If it was my WS Fiesta I'd start it 30 minutes early before I left work during clean up time then go back in to work and let it idle with the A/C going in the car park because it sucked hardcore on any day over 25.

I do the same if I lived where you do ( Mount Macedon), Be like living in the Ice Age.

[turbojosh]

I don't care what the car is or how modern it is... I'll warm anything up for minimum 5 minutes no matter how hot/cold the weather is. You look after your car, it'll look after you.

[LTDHO]

Originally Posted by turbojosh

I don't care what the car is or how modern it is... I'll warm anything up for minimum 5 minutes no matter how hot/cold the weather is. You look after your car, it'll look after you.

Glazed bores is looking after your car?

I idle long enough to get oil pressure, so about 10 seconds.
Drive gently until water temp is raised.

[buggo]

Wow man 30 mins to warm up seems a lil excessive.

I normally follow the procedure of turning on accessories and give it a sec or two for the fuel to prime, start it, spend a minute choosing a song, maybe a bit longer on a real cold morning and take it easy for 10 odd mins before giving it any real stick. The aircon is up to temp within a couple of minutes max.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by buggo

Wow man 30 mins to warm up seems a lil excessive.

I normally follow the procedure of turning on accessories and give it a sec or two for the fuel to prime, start it, spend a minute choosing a song, maybe a bit longer on a real cold morning and take it easy for 10 odd mins before giving it any real stick. The aircon is up to temp within a couple of minutes max.

That was only for the WS Fiesta because the A/C is horrible in those things, like a emphasaema sufferer in the dash blowing at you.

[mik]

I usually give it about 20 seconds before I drive off, and I try to lay of hard acceleration and higher rev range till it warms up to operating temp..........
As for idling for long periods i was told it glazes up the bores, rightly or wrongly i try and avoid it if possible.

[hedgehobb]

Yep, at least 1-2 minutes idle on cold mornings, then Grand-ma shift and make sure revs are kept low until temperature gauge shifts. Even then the tranny is still cold so at least 10-15 minutes babying the vehicle.

Once I am sure operating temps are optimal, I give it some "spirited" driving. Even modern engines are based on the laws of Thermodynamics. That is that metal heated will expand. And thrash a cold engine/tranny will shorten the life span of the potential of the vehicle.*

edit:*IMHO (no proof this is true apart from the metal expanding)

[CoupeKing]

I always warm mine up for a minute or 2, especially if you got an old rattler. Get those clearances happening. Im sure the people on here that race warm their motors up beforehand, more than likely for a number of reasons including prolonged engine life.

[Trump]

30 seconds idling if left overnight, then no shenanigans until it hits normal operating temp.
Excessive idling glazes the bores.

[johnydep]

Originally Posted by AAXR8

Hi, I was told by a neighbour that idling cars was not a good thing??
I was told different that you should warn your car up minimum 3 mins,
So as you can see we have a great to and throw conversation over the fence!!But can you idle a car for to long? What would be the Maximum you could idle a car for?? Or it dosn't matter as long as it does not over heat or any other problem etc?

A few year ago I watched a video that showed oil flow to the internals of an engine. From memory, it took 2 minutes for low viscosity oil to get to the valve train on an idling engine, and I think they had one that took about 8 minutes. That's not good, but it's something that an average owner would not notice - valve train wear causing slight performance/economy drop, and slight oil consumption at idle and down hill runs.

Long idle times can also cause cylinder bores to glaze - compression ring working with little to no load.

I've been taught to start the car and then get ready to drive - seat belt, check mirrors and surroundings, adjust radio etc and then drive off. 30 - 60 seconds is all it takes. Drive gently and all the cars mechanical componentry will warm up equally; and faster than idling in the driveway.

Another thing to note; it takes 10 km for an engine to reach complete operating temperature. This is when the unburnt hydrocarbons will burn off and dissolve. Idling in the driveway is fill your sump with unburnt hydrocarbons faster than driving.

[mechanic]

Agree with johnydep.
Because I was the new apprentice and had to get new cars from Brisbane to our workshop [ 340 miles, excuse the spelling as it's SOO night and I've had a few ], I used to pick brand new cars up and drive them home through the bush at night. These were BMC and Toyota, even then it was get in and drive.
When I started with Ford in '68 I was told don't worry about warming up periods and running in procedures. That workshop was only 130 ks from Brisbane and the boss would know how long it should take at the speed limit, used to ask questions if I was too late.
I've only had to deal with freezing temperatures when I worked In NZ for a while so don't really know what's the best in the southern states.
Start and go is my personal theory.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by johnydep

A few year ago I watched a video that showed oil flow to the internals of an engine. From memory, it took 2 minutes for low viscosity oil to get to the valve train on an idling engine, and I think they had one that took about 8 minutes. That's not good, but it's something that an average owner would not notice - valve train wear causing slight performance/economy drop, and slight oil consumption at idle and down hill runs.

Long idle times can also cause cylinder bores to glaze - compression ring working with little to no load.

I've been taught to start the car and then get ready to drive - seat belt, check mirrors and surroundings, adjust radio etc and then drive off. 30 - 60 seconds is all it takes. Drive gently and all the cars mechanical componentry will warm up equally; and faster than idling in the driveway.

Another thing to note; it takes 10 km for an engine to reach complete operating temperature. This is when the unburnt hydrocarbons will burn off and dissolve. Idling in the driveway is fill your sump with unburnt hydrocarbons faster than driving.

This. However, I've found the few Euro4 Falcons I've driven (and the SSV), warm up far quicker than my Euro3 XR.

[MAGPIE]

Originally Posted by johnydep

Another thing to note; it takes 10 km for an engine to reach complete operating temperature.

Surely this would vary with the ambient temperature and the manner in which the vehicle was driven

[jpd80]

I drive off steady in my EcoLPI Ute and it's up to temperature inside 2 to 3 minutes.
Modern emission control engines warm a lot faster than golden oldies.

[Jastel]

Cold car, 30 sec to a minute is plenty drive gently till operating temp is reached.

Glazing bores, no. My cabs run 24/7 and idle for long periods between jobs despite my best efforts to get the drivers to turn them off...the a/c doesn't work without the engine so they let them run. Its not their car....

[pottery beige]

if it starts

its ready to go

[CoupeKing]

Originally Posted by Jastel

My cabs run 24/7

I thought thats why most Taxis get huge mileage because they always run hot.

[mik]

Originally Posted by jpd80

I drive off steady in my EcoLPI Ute and it's up to temperature inside 2 to 3 minutes.
Modern emission control engines warm a lot faster than golden oldies.

I suspect you would find at 2 or 3 minutes tempreture would not be consistent right through the whole engine, but these modern engines with a fair bit of alloy in them would be much better off than something like a full cast iron clevo that could take upwards of 10 minutes to get uniform heat right through the block.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by mik

I suspect you would find at 2 or 3 minutes tempreture would not be consistent right through the whole engine, but these modern engines with a fair bit of alloy in them would be much better off than something like a full cast iron clevo that could take upwards of 10 minutes to get uniform heat right through the block.

I've owned many Clevelands in the past, the difference in warm up between a new FGII and the old henrys is astonishing.
The heater in my FGII Ute is pumping out hot air within 2 to 3 km from cold, I was amazed at how quickly they warm up.
It sounds like Ford has done a lot of work redesigning the block passages to get more heat in around the barrels and less in the head.

[johnydep]

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Surely this would vary with the ambient temperature and the manner in which the vehicle was driven

Yes. I was only giving the recommended average for total engine warm up, which includes driveline and heat soak to engine block, crankshaft, etc.

Other things to note about warm up; just because the cooling system temperature gauge shows a warm engine, it does not mean that the entire engine is up to operating temperature. And what's the point of having a warm engine if everything else is cold - gearbox, differential, bearings, etc.

There are more cons than pros to idling engines.

http://www.nrcan.gc.ca/energy/effici...on/idling/4423

To assess the impact of vehicle warm-up, Environment Canada conducted a test program using a cold chamber and three vehicles. Each vehicle was cooled to -18°C and driven over a simulated urban driving cycle. The test procedure was performed using a 5-minute warm-up before driving the simulation urban cycle and repeated using a 10-minute warm-up before driving the simulated urban cycle.

The test results showed that with a 5-minute warm-up total fuel consumption increased by 7 to 14 percent and with a 10-minute warm-up total fuel consumption increased by 12 to 19 percent6. This also leads to a similar increase in carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions, as they are an unavoidable by-product of burning fossil fuels.

Contrary to popular belief, excessive idling is not an effective way to warm up your vehicle, even in cold weather. The best way to warm it up is to drive it. In fact, with today's computer-controlled engines, even on cold winter days, usually no more than two to three minutes of idling is enough warm-up time needed for the average vehicle before starting to drive – but make sure that windows are free from snow and properly defrosted before driving away!

Please consult your owner's manual or your vehicle service advisor if you would like a recommendation specific to your vehicle or climatic conditions.

http://www.f1technical.net/forum/vie...php?f=4&t=9362

F1 engines ARE warmed up on a computer program

Generally the engines revs will be raised/lowered, and blipped to put load into the engine, as well as keep the alternator charging, as its designed to work for longer periods at much higher RPMs.

A lot of the mild blipping ( and what sounds like a spark cutting out) is the gearbox being cycled up and down through the gears, to get that up to temperature. In our cars we used to drag the brake pedal a little, to load up the drivetrain. The techs may also check the pit limiter function etc, and other things I can only imagine!

While at idle & elevated RPM, a dipstick reading will be taken of the engine oil tank, and any oil added if required. The water header tank will also be checked and purged if required.

Generally temperatures will be taken just above operating temperature prior to shutdown, to allow heatsoak into the radiators, for when the cars are fired up in anger.

http://www.idlefreevt.org/how-long-s...icle-idle.html

HOW LONG SHOULD A VEHICLE WARM UP AT A STANDSTILL?

LIGHT-DUTY GASOLINE & DIESEL (car, SUV, pickup): The overall recommendation is 30 seconds (check your owners manual for any specific recommendations; many manuals recommend avoiding long warm-ups or no warm-ups at all, such as stated in the 2013 BMW 3 Series manual).

• Above freezing temperatures: typically no need to warm-up at standstill; the best way to warm up is to drive the vehicle at a moderate pace.

• Below freezing but above 0 degrees Fahrenheit: up to 30 seconds[1] to allow for complete circulation of engine oil[2]. Warm-up time is also determined by the effectiveness of defrosting - do not drive if you can't see clearly out of the windshield. Again, driving the car (slowly to moderately) is the best way to warm up in this range. Note that wheel bearings, steering, suspension, transmission, catalytic converter, and tires also need warming up. The only way to do that is to drive the vehicle.

• Below 0 degrees: in this range, idling the engine for a period of 1 to 3 minutes can become necessary, allowing thickened engine oil to adequately circulate throughout the engine, and for the likely increased time needed for defrosting/deicing. More than three minutes even in these conditions is considered excessive.

[b2428]

On a cold night after work its normally a 1 smoke idle just to warm the diesel up a bit otherwise it's just a take it easy for first few Kays thing. Finding atm it takes ages to move the temp guage however. The colder its getting the longer it takes. After driving is different if I have been having a go always like to give it a few minutes. If I have been taking it easier normally just enough to check the windows are up.

When I was going for my truck license the instructor was always happy with it going off after reversing into the yard so figured taking it easy before turning it off was good enough.

On another note though I was told you should make sure the air con is turned off before starting. Something about less strain on the engine. Never done it though due to both the monde and falcon taking there time to start working. Both have climate control. Not sure about normal air.

[GASWAGON]

The latest news is that with 'modern' engines (Post 2000) the metals that are used are much more tolerent to temp conditions......So its perfectly o.k to take off even after 5 seconds.

Thats the beauty of modern tech even though it can be a real pain when it breaks down.

[mr smith]

I have it in gear before the starter motor has even stopped spining. Warming up is old dude stuff.

[Sox]

Originally Posted by turbojosh

I don't care what the car is or how modern it is... I'll warm anything up for minimum 5 minutes no matter how hot/cold the weather is. You look after your car, it'll look after you.

Unfortunately you're not looking after it by doing that.
Idling an engine to warm up is worse than driving off cold.

Originally Posted by mr smith

I have it in gear before the starter motor has even stopped spining. Warming up is old dude stuff.

Correct.

There is no compelling reason to warm up a modern car engine by stationary idling.

We used to idle our engines because they wouldn't run well with carburettors when cold.
Modern engines are ready to drive immediately, and better for it.

Engines warm up much faster when driving than idling.
Not only that, the rest of the drive train, transmission, diff, tyres, also warm up at the same time.

Idling an engine to warm up is not only totally unnecessary, but wasteful of fuel.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by Sox

Idling an engine to warm up is not only totally unnecessary, but wasteful of fuel.

Wrong. With all of the engine oil in the sump after sitting overnight, taking off just after turning the key can be problematic. With no oil in the upper engine (read valvetrain), accelerated wear happens.

[Sox]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

Wrong. With all of the engine oil in the sump after sitting overnight, taking off just after turning the key can be problematic. With no oil in the upper engine (read valvetrain), accelerated wear happens.

Nope.
The oil flows through an engine much faster if the revs are above idle, such as driving.