Australia,s Rarest muscle cars

[Stefan]

Originally Posted by PlukaDuck

The other 97 where plated as landau
Allowing moffat to use 4 wheel disc brakes

You're the expert now, but 5 post ago telling us how your XD 302 had a factory 9" diff.... credibility = 0

HAHAHAHAHA.....seriously WTF.....HAHAHAHAHA

[PlukaDuck]

Originally Posted by Stefan

You're the expert now, but 5 post ago telling us how your XD 302 had a factory 9" diff.... credibility = 0

HAHAHAHAHA.....seriously WTF.....HAHAHAHAHA

Is that right DETECTIVE STALKER STEFAN ?
Please copy and paste where I stated that??????
Have fun
Jokes on you
You just have to deal with the fact that millions of falcons where produced and Falcon GT, is just an optioned falcon. Get over it

[tezxr8man]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

The 2 doors still weighed under 1500kg.
So with a supposed 300-odd hp then it should be quicker regardless of the 3 speed auto.
Comparing it to other US muscle cars of that era it should run 15s in the quarter, if the actual power figure is correct.

Maybe the gear ratio had a part to play??

[tezxr8man]

Originally Posted by Stefan

I'm a believer of this.

If you find the article (I think it was Wheels July 1972) in which those famous photos of the three red race cars in Lot 6 featured, the first line of the article was something like "the first batch of 100 XA GTHOs have just rolled off the production line, with the final 100 scheduled to be built in the next month."

It also had a copy of a Ford internal memo to dealers stating "Gentleman, production of the XA GTHO has commenced" It then talked about forwarding sales receipts back to Head Office in preparation for submission to CAMS in order to ensure it qualifies for racing"

Why would Wheels and Ford lie? Where did the supposed 100 GTHOs end up? Most logical is replated as GTs

didn't they end up going out the back door as regular GT's and internally coded as RPO83, when the sh#t hit the fan??

[mik]

Originally Posted by shonkymofo

don't see how heavy duty axle = 9 inch

XD was not available with 9 inch

interesting comments on the 9 inch, back in the day i was at a ford dealer that had the police contract, and though i'm getting a bit foggy in my old age, i would bet my left one, i have seen a fairly newish at the time an xd interceptor with a 9" diff, complete with yellow paint, rubber floormats , tbar auto, power steering, perhaps it was a special i don't know..

[Blue Roo]

Originally Posted by Stefan

I'm a believer of this.

If you find the article (I think it was Wheels July 1972) in which those famous photos of the three red race cars in Lot 6 featured, the first line of the article was something like "the first batch of 100 XA GTHOs have just rolled off the production line, with the final 100 scheduled to be built in the next month."

It also had a copy of a Ford internal memo to dealers stating "Gentleman, production of the XA GTHO has commenced" It then talked about forwarding sales receipts back to Head Office in preparation for submission to CAMS in order to ensure it qualifies for racing"

Why would Wheels and Ford lie? Where did the supposed 100 GTHOs end up? Most logical is replated as GTs

I'm no expert. But when Ford was in the process of building the GTHO Phase 4's, when the program was cancelled. Even Howard Marsden laid claim to this. Ford was planning to build 200 Units (cars) over 2 months, June and July. And Ford had stockpiled the 200 homologated parts ready to go.

But, as history tell us. The Super Car Scare that happened at the end of June killed the program, and 20 plus Phase 4 car bodies were dumped and buried out at the Ford Proving Ground.

And if any Phase 4s made it down the Assemble Line and a small amount of them did . Some of the noticeable Phase 4 Parts would have been taken off and there Compliance Plate changed to a normal GT. Except for the Pre Production Phase 4. But that's my opinion.

Ford would have lost a huge amount of money on the cancellation of the Phase 4 Program.

[2011G6E]

With the Phase 4 bits, didn't they offer the Globe Bathurst wheels to recent XY GT buyers or something at a special price? Wonder what a set of those would be worth if you could somehow prove what they were?

If you're talking "rare", then probably the rarest of the rare is the one and only factory built mule made by Chrysler as a test bed for the upcoming VH E38 Charger. It was a VG Pacer, fitted with the E38-spec 265 hemi and all Charger running gear. It was driven around for quite a while, and went to Italy for four months to have the Weber sidedraft carbs sorted by the Weber factory. It then came back to Australia and was sold to an employee...and promptly got forgotten about.

For decades people have searched high and low wondering whatever happened to this factory special. Wonder where it is?

[HO 3]

Originally Posted by mik

interesting comments on the 9 inch, back in the day i was at a ford dealer that had the police contract, and though i'm getting a bit foggy in my old age, i would bet my left one, i have seen a fairly newish at the time an xd interceptor with a 9" diff, complete with yellow paint, rubber floormats , tbar auto, power steering, perhaps it was a special i don't know..

That was normally the first modification, dropping in a 9 inch after picking up a XD chaser from gov auction.........they use to go for anywhere from 4.5-6k depending on Kms and how beat up they were........next mods were usually widened chrome twelve slots or Hotwires etc, then maybe a shaker and 4v heads.

Cheers Mick

[2011G6E]

Yep, the usual price at the police auctions for the more desirable models was half the price new, and that was for 18 month to two year old cars. Way back in, I think, '83 a workmate went to Brisbane to the police auctions to "buy an ex-police car", and we told him to be careful, as they were usually thrashed and had holes drilled everywhere inside.
He came back with a metallic gold XE Fairmont Ghia, with a V8, auto, luxury trim, good stereo, air, power steer, power windows, and only a couple of small holes drilled in one side of the center console. We asked him how he got that at a police auction, and he smiled and said "Always look for the detectives cars...less wear and tear, usually better spec, and better looked after". I think he paid about $6000 for it, and it was 18 months old. A new Fairmont Ghia would have cost over double that. Lucky bugger.

[castellan]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

With the Phase 4 bits, didn't they offer the Globe Bathurst wheels to recent XY GT buyers or something at a special price? Wonder what a set of those would be worth if you could somehow prove what they were?

If you're talking "rare", then probably the rarest of the rare is the one and only factory built mule made by Chrysler as a test bed for the upcoming VH E38 Charger. It was a VG Pacer, fitted with the E38-spec 265 hemi and all Charger running gear. It was driven around for quite a while, and went to Italy for four months to have the Weber sidedraft carbs sorted by the Weber factory. It then came back to Australia and was sold to an employee...and promptly got forgotten about.

For decades people have searched high and low wondering whatever happened to this factory special. Wonder where it is?

A dude on the Gold Coas has that VG Pacer ute.

[castellan]

Originally Posted by HO 3

That was normally the first modification, dropping in a 9 inch after picking up a XD chaser from gov auction.........they use to go for anywhere from 4.5-6k depending on Kms and how beat up they were........next mods were usually widened chrome twelve slots or Hotwires etc, then maybe a shaker and 4v heads.

Cheers Mick

Nothing wrong with the B/W 4 star diff behind a 5.8L i never heard of them blowing up.
A dude who lived next door to me had a XD 5.8L 4sp right from new, he blew up the motor 3 times but never the diff.

[FTe342]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

With the Phase 4 bits, didn't they offer the Globe Bathurst wheels to recent XY GT buyers or something at a special price? Wonder what a set of those would be worth if you could somehow prove what they were?

If you're talking "rare", then probably the rarest of the rare is the one and only factory built mule made by Chrysler as a test bed for the upcoming VH E38 Charger. It was a VG Pacer, fitted with the E38-spec 265 hemi and all Charger running gear. It was driven around for quite a while, and went to Italy for four months to have the Weber sidedraft carbs sorted by the Weber factory. It then came back to Australia and was sold to an employee...and promptly got forgotten about.

For decades people have searched high and low wondering whatever happened to this factory special. Wonder where it is?

If there is any truth to that story, its no wonder Chrysler Australia went broke. Why would you send a car to Italy to sort the tune on carbies when you could fly the technician here to do the same thing ?

Its not that hard. My brother sorted the twin side draft Webers he had hanging off the side of his GT Cortina motor in his 440. And he's not a mechanic by trade. The point is, many people in Oz would have been capable of "sorting" the triple Webers

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by FTe342

If there is any truth to that story, its no wonder Chrysler Australia went broke. Why would you send a car to Italy to sort the tune on carbies when you could fly the technician here to do the same thing ?

Its not that hard. My brother sorted the twin side draft Webers he had hanging off the side of his GT Cortina motor in his 440. And he's not a mechanic by trade. The point is, many people in Oz would have been capable of "sorting" the triple Webers

The car went to the actual Weber factory in Italy to be set up and tuned and modified to suit, which, to be blunt, is where most of the people who knew anything at all about Weber carbs at the time were located.
You have to remember back then that Webers, especially side draft ones, were usually only seen on funny little Italian cars occasionally, and many mechanics here in Australia didn't know how to sort them out. Surely people remember someone they know who bought an aftermarket side draft Weber (which were a popular mod there for a while in the late seventies and eighties) and then was constantly tuning the thing...usually to eventually bin it and buy a Holley..
Hell, even "normal" Italian cars at the time were a bit of a nightmare for local mechanics, and for some reason Chrysler chose to slap a set of highly strung triple sidedraft Webers on it's you beaut new engine. It was a very strange move for an Australian car company.
No idea why they didn't go with a four barrel like the earlier Pacers had as an option, but there you go...it did allow the hemi six to sing like Pavarotti, produce over 320hp, and outrun any V8 in the country at the time...

I remember reading a bit of trivia about the setting up of the Webers was that the factory in Italy discovered they ran much better on the 265 hemi six without a gasket between manifold and carby...just a bit of sealant. Apparently many later tuners got caught out because they would remove the carb for some reason and fit a normal thick and soft carby gasket (as you usually see in a base gasket kit from the old days), then it would need to be tuned again because it had gone funny.

[FTe342]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

The car went to the actual Weber factory in Italy to be set up and tuned and modified to suit, which, to be blunt, is where most of the people who knew anything at all about Weber carbs at the time were located.
You have to remember back then that Webers, especially side draft ones, were usually only seen on funny little Italian cars occasionally, and many mechanics here in Australia didn't know how to sort them out. Surely people remember someone they know who bought an aftermarket side draft Weber (which were a popular mod there for a while in the late seventies and eighties) and then was constantly tuning the thing...usually to eventually bin it and buy a Holley..

My brothers foray into sorting his Webers was > 40 yrs ago. Hell, how hard can it be. You choose a carbie that flows what the engine needs and then jet it to get the right AFR's (which you established by looking at plug colour). It was a mechanical device - no electronics. You had to compromise a bit, to get it to scream it had to be a bit rich at idle. This car wasn't far behind 351's at the drags

Anyway, like I said - no wonder they went broke - it would have been easier to bring the technician to the problem than to send a car to the tech on the other side of the world. The mind boggles

[290GTP]

Manufacturers send their cars all over the world for testing all the time. Ford sent BF GT's to ZF in Germany to test and tune. Drop in the ocean really money wise for a car company.

[FTe342]

Originally Posted by 290GTP

Manufacturers send their cars all over the world for testing all the time. Ford sent BF GT's to ZF in Germany to test and tune. Drop in the ocean really money wise for a car company.

And now who is closing up shop in OZ ! Enough said

Anyway, back on topic

[290GTP]

Originally Posted by FTe342

And now who is closing up shop in OZ ! Enough said

Anyway, back on topic

Yeah I thought you would say something like that. Don't think it sent Ford broke though.

Back on topic now.

[2011G6E]

Even now you can ship cars around the world for very reasonable prices, and that's as a private individual, ignoring what price a large company could do with deals. No biggie to ship a car half way around the world.

[vbvbvb088]

As a challenge... has anyone here ever seen / owned / photographed / been in a HB Braham Torana?

[Cuyper]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Why are they so slow to 100 when they've got that much torque and power? Is it because of the 3 speed box?

Surely cars from the 70s wouldn't have been that heavy relative to the cars of today?

Power ratings from back in the day were pretty dodgy. They tested the motors without any accessory's or exhausts and even then the numbers were probably pumped up. Now days they are tested fully equipped. Plus back then tyres were rubbish. The XY HO could spin all gears on it's original tyres. Can't dream about it now on modern rubber.

[Cuyper]

Originally Posted by vbvbvb088

As a challenge... has anyone here ever seen / owned / photographed / been in a HB Braham Torana?

I've seen them driving around, but not since the 1980s. In the end everything is rare. There were so many options back in the day most cars were unique to themselves. I did see a blue fairlane with the phase 4 sump on in at a car yard in the early 90s. It was 3 grand and I had no money :p. Don't think the motor itself was actually anything special

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by vbvbvb088

As a challenge... has anyone here ever seen / owned / photographed / been in a HB Braham Torana?

yea, a family friend had one when i was a little tacker

[XBROO]

I remember HB Torana, what was so special about Braham?

[XBROO]

Don't worry google was my friend. Have a look at the old ad who needed a 4x4 back then?
http://www.uniquecarsandparts.com.au..._torana_hb.htm

[castellan]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

The car went to the actual Weber factory in Italy to be set up and tuned and modified to suit, which, to be blunt, is where most of the people who knew anything at all about Weber carbs at the time were located.
You have to remember back then that Webers, especially side draft ones, were usually only seen on funny little Italian cars occasionally, and many mechanics here in Australia didn't know how to sort them out. Surely people remember someone they know who bought an aftermarket side draft Weber (which were a popular mod there for a while in the late seventies and eighties) and then was constantly tuning the thing...usually to eventually bin it and buy a Holley..
Hell, even "normal" Italian cars at the time were a bit of a nightmare for local mechanics, and for some reason Chrysler chose to slap a set of highly strung triple sidedraft Webers on it's you beaut new engine. It was a very strange move for an Australian car company.
No idea why they didn't go with a four barrel like the earlier Pacers had as an option, but there you go...it did allow the hemi six to sing like Pavarotti, produce over 320hp, and outrun any V8 in the country at the time...

I remember reading a bit of trivia about the setting up of the Webers was that the factory in Italy discovered they ran much better on the 265 hemi six without a gasket between manifold and carby...just a bit of sealant. Apparently many later tuners got caught out because they would remove the carb for some reason and fit a normal thick and soft carby gasket (as you usually see in a base gasket kit from the old days), then it would need to be tuned again because it had gone funny.

I don't think Valiant australia people were that bright they were blowing up the hemi 6 in the begining of testing due to using the std heat range spark plugs.
The webers were mucked around for months in Italy to get them right, i think they ended up using only half of each weber.

The 4 barrel was not as good as the 2 barrel on the VG 245 pacer and my brothers mate had used both on his pacer and said the same and that thing went well. she was a hardtop with lake pipes.

[castellan]

Originally Posted by XBROO

I remember HB Torana, what was so special about Braham?

HB Brabham torana is a power house with twin Zenith stromberg CD-150
79 HP @5600RPM
Sports dash and all with strips to go.
We exported this car as well to the UK i think.
They are worth big money today.

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by FTe342

Of course the T3 TL50 is a Muscle Car.

<snip>

But of course my opinion may be a little bit biased

T3 TL50 #147 Silhouette Auto ESS - Brembos - only AUIII TL50 ever built

So YOU've got it?
The ONLY 2002 TL50 ever built?

Sorry to everyone else, but THAT's a stat that can NEVER be beaten.
There was only one, and that's a matter of historical fact, rather than conjecture.
And its rarity is based on model production, not some "unique" combination of options. Also the TL50 IS a distinct model, its NOT just a Fairlane with stripes.

[MethodX]

How about.... Capri V6?
Would they classify? Certainly look the part.
Not that many were made or imported.

[Nova 8]

VS Manta station wagon is pretty rare with only 10 (I believe) being made and kinda fits the bill for being a muscle car. In the 90s at least.

[max_torq]

Capri isn't a muscle car, its a GT! a genuine one: Capri once came 5th at Le Mans 24Hr!