Welcome to the Australian Ford Forums forum.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and inserts advertising. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features without post based advertising banners. Registration is simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

Please Note: All new registrations go through a manual approval queue to keep spammers out. This is checked twice each day so there will be a delay before your registration is activated.

Go Back   Australian Ford Forums > General Topics > The Pub

The Pub For General Automotive Related Talk

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 30-08-2019, 06:58 AM   #1
Dr Smith
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Melb.
Posts: 3,270
Default Powertrain options

I was filling in time surfing car websites and thought if I was to buy something today, what powertrain option would I really want.

I'll be upfront and say if any choice was available I'd love the new 3.0L V6 Ecoboost/Hybrid of the Explorer/Lincoln Aviator, potentially near 300kW iirc

Now it doesn't have to be so powerful (who am I kidding..yes it should) however I don't think I'd buy diesel just because of our driving environment where the hybrid side would cover the short trip, the combined powertrain would give the punch and I don't think running costs would be so much more as petrol for a long time now here is almost 20c/L cheaper.

Whether I was buying a Ranger or Terry replacement I'd prefer petrol, something with good performance and a hybrid that self-charges rather then plug-in.

A recent motoring article mentioned petrol SUV's are gaining sales vs diesel and I would think a powertrain like the new 3.0L V6 Ecoboost hybrid is perfect for Australia...hint, hint...
Dr Smith is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
2 users like this post:
Old 30-08-2019, 07:41 AM   #2
Brazen
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Brazen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,844
Default Re: Powertrain options

A V6 Hybrid would be awesome. There is a strong possibility the next Kluger here will have a 3.5 V6 hybrid drivetrain and i bet it will be great.

I had a 4 cylinder hybrid Camry and that instant electric torque made it stronger off the line than my Falcon (and it averaged lifetime 5.6 L/100km). A V6 hybrid would be the ducks guts
Brazen is online now   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-08-2019, 12:45 PM   #3
Bevsta007
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Bevsta007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Victoria
Posts: 5,770
Default Re: Powertrain options

I've read Nissan, Great Wall & Haval next gen utes will have hybrid. probably more.

step up Ford, you already have the technology.
__________________
______________________________
Mine 2015 Territory Titanium RWD Diesel
Hers 2004 Prado Grande 3.0D
Ours Seadoo Challenger 210SE 310HP
Bevsta007 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-08-2019, 01:04 PM   #4
lra
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 505
Default Re: Powertrain options

[QUOTE=Dr Smith;6334937 A recent motoring article mentioned petrol SUV's are gaining sales vs diesel and I would think a powertrain like the new 3.0L V6 Ecoboost hybrid is perfect for Australia...hint, hint...[/QUOTE]

Petrol SUVs and utes, tell 'im he's dreaming. Toyota have just ditched the V8 petrol Land Cruiser.
Apart from the 2.0l petrol Great Wall Steed, what other ute/pickup has a petrol engine ? Europe is banning diesels, and our market is flooded with them, because the car companies tell us that is what we want.
I would love to update to a new ute, but not a ladder framed, soot blowing, rear drum braked modern antique.
Choice ? What is that, a Kiwi expression ÖÖ "Choice, bro."
lra is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-08-2019, 01:29 PM   #5
Dr Terry
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 665
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by lra View Post
Apart from the 2.0l petrol Great Wall Steed, what other ute/pickup has a petrol engine ?
Toyota Hilux Workmate 2.7 Petrol. Nissan Navara 2.5 Petrol. Mitsubishi Triton 2.4 Petrol.

Ford, Holden, Mazda have nothing. Where is the Hyundai Ute/Pick-Up, it's way overdue ??

Petrol commercial vehicles might be making a bit of a comeback. The just-released new Toyota Hiace has a 3.5 V6 petrol as the base engine.

Dr Terry
Dr Terry is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 30-08-2019, 01:52 PM   #6
lra
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 505
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Terry View Post
Toyota Hilux Workmate 2.7 Petrol. Nissan Navara 2.5 Petrol. Mitsubishi Triton 2.4 Petrol. Dr Terry
OK, granted the Toyota and Mitsi do have a poverty spec single cab ute.
I could not find a petrol Navara on the Nissan site but.
Suppose I could go with a RAM ( with enough $$$$)

RIP Ö. the affordable, Australian availability V6 or V8 petrol utes of the past.
lra is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-08-2019, 01:55 PM   #7
Brazen
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Brazen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,844
Default Re: Powertrain options

A decent petrol V6 dual cab could do well. Lots of owners who are over diesel.
Brazen is online now   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 30-08-2019, 02:39 PM   #8
Bossxr8
Peter Car
 
Bossxr8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: geelong
Posts: 18,395
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brazen View Post
A decent petrol V6 dual cab could do well. Lots of owners who are over diesel.
Toyota had the petrol V6 in the Hilux and it made up like 1% of sales, so they ditched it.

The options have been there in the past but next to no buyers.

It would be good to have a choice of a good petrol engine in a dual cab but the numbers of buyers just aren't there. Problem is heavy vehicles with big petrol engines suck the juice, so despite people thinking they would want one, having to fill it up all the time at a high cost means they don't go through with it.

Better off with a big grunt V6 or V8 turbo diesel.
Bossxr8 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
3 users like this post:
Old 30-08-2019, 03:02 PM   #9
roKWiz
Cabover nut
 
roKWiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Onsite Eastcoast
Posts: 2,011
Default Re: Powertrain options

It funny how the whole point of originally owning a mechanical injected diesel 4x4 was when going into the outback it was a reliable vehicle that didn't drink lot of fuel and have lots of electronics that older diesels don't need, If it did breakdown, it was relatively easy to fix on the side of the road/track.
I can see why no one wants modern diesels but are electronic petrol engines any better as Bossxr8 states.
__________________
heritagestonemason.com/Fordlouisvillerestoration
In order that the labour of centuries past may not be in vain during the centuries to come...... D. Diderot 1752

VT903 Cummins K125 Kenworth | 6V53 Detroit Ford LN8000 Louisville
4 X 0409 Ford traders | Nanni diesel 30ft Hartley silver Image yacht
and the mighty 4.1 XF Ford Pano
roKWiz is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-08-2019, 03:57 PM   #10
Crazy Dazz
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Perth, Northern Suburbs
Posts: 3,651
Default Re: Powertrain options

It will be interesting to see what happens with diesels.
The basic problem is that they don't play well with Cats. But surely modern turbo-diesels, especially those with a throttle and stop-start, can be tuned to work better?
I guess the big issue would be the drop in power if they wind back the the over-fuelling?

The very interesting thing will be, if we move back towards more petrol engines, whether LPG starts to make a comeback.

Something I have never understood is why the Hybrid push started with small cars that were economical anyway, where the added weight & bulk of the hybrid system and battery was an imposition, and the additional cost prohibitive. Why don't we have Hybrid Buses and Trucks?

To get back to the OP's question:
IF you're talking about an Engine that you really WANT. Then, for me:
NO V6's. Goddamn awful engines with no redeeming qualities. (Other than being compact and CHEAP.)
NO Turbos. I drive a turbo, and its an easy way to get more power, but they don't improve engines, and I don't really like them.
NO naff names like ecoboost, ecotech, etc. If you have to name your engine, make it something cool, like the "Grunter."

I still like the I6. Particularly with twin variable cams. Something with a lightweight alloy block, around 3.6L

For allround niceness and symmetry, its still hard to go past a V8. All alloy, around 4.0L
It would be nice to see what modern design and manufacturing could do with a single cam, perhaps with some kind of variable time and lift.

The exception I would make to forced induction would be a electric super-charger as part of a Hybrid Miller-Cycle engine.

As a left-field option, I would love to see what modern design, materials, and engine management, could do with a hybrid ****el.
Crazy Dazz is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-08-2019, 04:18 PM   #11
Dr Smith
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Melb.
Posts: 3,270
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bossxr8 View Post
Toyota had the petrol V6 in the Hilux and it made up like 1% of sales, so they ditched it.

The options have been there in the past but next to no buyers.

It would be good to have a choice of a good petrol engine in a dual cab but the numbers of buyers just aren't there. Problem is heavy vehicles with big petrol engines suck the juice, so despite people thinking they would want one, having to fill it up all the time at a high cost means they don't go through with it.

Better off with a big grunt V6 or V8 turbo diesel.
While I accept your points with respect to commercial vehicles carrying loads, I'm thinking more the urban suv, like our case, wife might drive into the CBD 3 times a week, one way it's 18km, on a hybrid it would probably run electric the whole way so no petrol used at all, then when "I" get into it on the weekend I have 300kW..

edit.. I need to seek help, I think I've watched every video on the Lincoln Aviator and now the hybrid reviews are coming out...
Dr Smith is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 30-08-2019, 09:16 PM   #12
Crazy Dazz
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Perth, Northern Suburbs
Posts: 3,651
Default Re: Powertrain options

Why can't I say ****el?

That was his name, Felix ****el.

Next we'll be banned from talking about John ****per
Crazy Dazz is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 31-08-2019, 04:55 AM   #13
chevypower
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
chevypower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Park City, Utah
Posts: 3,318
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by roKWiz View Post
It funny how the whole point of originally owning a mechanical injected diesel 4x4 was when going into the outback it was a reliable vehicle that didn't drink lot of fuel and have lots of electronics that older diesels don't need, If it did breakdown, it was relatively easy to fix on the side of the road/track.
I can see why no one wants modern diesels but are electronic petrol engines any better as Bossxr8 states.
Yes comparing current generation petrol vs Diesel engines, the diesel is way more complex and more expensive. It used to be that if you were doing a lot of heavy pulling, the diesel would pay you back in fuel savings. I donít even think thatís true anymore. It does still give you a lot more low end torque, unless the petrol engine is turbocharged. But the petrol can still be nicer to drive.
chevypower is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 31-08-2019, 10:25 AM   #14
XR Martin
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
XR Martin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Canberra Region
Posts: 7,347
Default Re: Powertrain options

Next Gen Kluger will be hybrid only
__________________
2016 FGX XR8 Sprint, 6speed manual, Kinetic Blue #170

2004 BA wagon RTV project.

1998 EL XR8, Auto, Hot Chilli Red

1993 ED XR6, 5speed, Polynesian Green. 1 of 329. Retired

1968 XT Falcon 500 wagon, 3 on the tree, 3.6L. Patina project.
XR Martin is online now   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 31-08-2019, 11:49 AM   #15
minheim
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 332
Default Re: Powertrain options

Interesting that in the USA the Ranger is petrol only and has a 2.3L ecoboost engine producing 201kW and 420Nm at 3000rpm, mated to a 10-speed automatic transmission. The petrol ranger is highly regarded in the USA. Notwithstanding this Ford Australia apparently have decided Australia only gets diesels. More details in this link - https://www.drive.com.au/news/us-cri...-ranger-120402.
I think the ecoboost petrol engines are pretty good. I have an escape titanium and it is a great highway cruiser with enough poke and grunt. I only do highway miles in it as local duties and shopping trips are done in the old second car. The escape might be a bit thirstier than some other SUVs but I like the extra power (and the conventional torque auto in place of a Dual Clutch Auto or CVT). I wonder what a 2.3 ecoboost in an Escape with a 10 speed would be like.
minheim is online now   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 31-08-2019, 05:16 PM   #16
Dr Smith
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Melb.
Posts: 3,270
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by minheim View Post
Interesting that in the USA the Ranger is petrol only and has a 2.3L ecoboost engine producing 201kW and 420Nm at 3000rpm, mated to a 10-speed automatic transmission. The petrol ranger is highly regarded in the USA. Notwithstanding this Ford Australia apparently have decided Australia only gets diesels. More details in this link - https://www.drive.com.au/news/us-cri...-ranger-120402.
I think the ecoboost petrol engines are pretty good. I have an escape titanium and it is a great highway cruiser with enough poke and grunt. I only do highway miles in it as local duties and shopping trips are done in the old second car. The escape might be a bit thirstier than some other SUVs but I like the extra power (and the conventional torque auto in place of a Dual Clutch Auto or CVT). I wonder what a 2.3 ecoboost in an Escape with a 10 speed would be like.
Ford is tending to use the 8-speed auto in fwd/awd cars and 10-speed auto in rwd/awd platforms. Next Escape/Kuga has an 8-speed.
There are some exceptions like Shelby Mustang with a dual-clutch Tremec and maybe Focus hipo versions. I believe the Transit Custom vans will go 8-speed for fwd and maybe 10-speed for Transit large rwd.

Last edited by Dr Smith; 31-08-2019 at 05:22 PM.
Dr Smith is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 31-08-2019, 06:05 PM   #17
Crazy Dazz
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Perth, Northern Suburbs
Posts: 3,651
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by minheim View Post
Interesting that in the USA the Ranger is petrol only
Not really interesting, Americans think Diesels are a Communist Conspiracy
Crazy Dazz is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
This user likes this post:
Old 31-08-2019, 06:09 PM   #18
eb2fairmont
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 762
Default Re: Powertrain options

Errr get them talking about the Cummins 12 v and the power stroke and they’ll dribble for hiurs
eb2fairmont is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 02-09-2019, 02:33 PM   #19
Bossxr8
Peter Car
 
Bossxr8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: geelong
Posts: 18,395
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Smith View Post
While I accept your points with respect to commercial vehicles carrying loads, I'm thinking more the urban suv, like our case, wife might drive into the CBD 3 times a week, one way it's 18km, on a hybrid it would probably run electric the whole way so no petrol used at all, then when "I" get into it on the weekend I have 300kW..

edit.. I need to seek help, I think I've watched every video on the Lincoln Aviator and now the hybrid reviews are coming out...
Well the Ford SUV's will eventually all have a hybrid option. They have already stated they want just about every vehicle they make to have one in the range. And we are starting to see that now. Escape Hybrid has already been revealed and is coming here. Mustang Hybrid has already been talked about. Plus they did that video on the all electric F150 towing that train.

Give it a few years and they will be more readily available. As you point out, hybrids may make petrol motors more appealing and may eventually replace diesels. But then again, they can do diesel hybrids too.
Bossxr8 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 02-09-2019, 03:06 PM   #20
Bevsta007
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Bevsta007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Victoria
Posts: 5,770
Default Re: Powertrain options

Funny how the tech behind Diesel electric Locomotives never made its way to cars
__________________
______________________________
Mine 2015 Territory Titanium RWD Diesel
Hers 2004 Prado Grande 3.0D
Ours Seadoo Challenger 210SE 310HP
Bevsta007 is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 02-09-2019, 07:55 PM   #21
The Yeti
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
The Yeti's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: In my happy place
Posts: 5,296
Default Re: Powertrain options

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevsta007 View Post
Funny how the tech behind Diesel electric Locomotives never made its way to cars
Has in port and plant equipment though
__________________
Pariahs C.C.
What could possibly go wrong

I post images with postimg.cc (so I donít forget)
The Yeti is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Old 03-09-2019, 07:02 PM   #22
Sabantien
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 883
Default Re: Powertrain options

I guess it depends on what vehicle. I really like my barra, but would not mind giving a turbo a go.

In a 4wd, i'd probably choose diesel. A workmate has a V6 hilux, and as a passenger I found it was quiet and smooth and more car-like, but he's keen to get into a diesel.

I want a 4wd, and i'd probably go diesel too, the petrols use way too much fuel, plus diesel is often cheaper, at least the same price as 91 fuel.



Theoretically what would I like? A plug in hybrid that works both the electric motor and the engine together to increase range (I don't want to drive electric until that runs out and then a crappy little engine kicks in), without sacrificing power in the ICE, nor sacrificing a good sized fuel tank. The ability to drive around town on the electric motor would be nice.

A PHEV Outlander would almost fit the bill, but terrible range, terrible engine.
Sabantien is offline   Reply With Quote Multi-Quote with this Post
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +11. The time now is 08:54 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Other than what is legally copyrighted by the respective owners, this site is copyright www.fordforums.com.au
Positive SSL