fuel saving stop/start for falcon ecolpi

[TMC]

Originally Posted by Rodp

A whole 3? Suggest you don't try Sydney peak hour traffic.

I knew someone in Sydney would say something like that. Have you driven here? Peak hour extends from 5am until 11pm here. I was driving down Great Eastern Highway yesterday and it felt like China. Roadworks for miles, 40km limit, road narrowed down to take your wing mirrors off due to the barriers and the worst part, people who can't drive and know how to stay in their lanes.

Sydney traffic is heavy I give you that, but at least you guys can drive and are courteous. I didn't mind Sydney traffic actually. People go when they should and they let you in. In Perth they'll try and t bone you.

Also with the 3 light thing (at 1.30pm in the arvo, technically not peak hour), the roads are often designed to put a set of traffic lights within 200-300m of the next. I used to work in the engineering department of a local council and that was considered bad design practice, yet that's exactly what they've done here.

But you can laugh. We haven't had tumble weed and kangaroos in the main street since the 1850's.

[mik]

Originally Posted by TMC

I knew someone in Sydney would say something like that. Have you driven here? Peak hour extends from 5am until 11pm here. I was driving down Great Eastern Highway yesterday and it felt like China. Roadworks for miles, 40km limit, road narrowed down to take your wing mirrors off due to the barriers and the worst part, people who can't drive and know how to stay in their lanes.

Sydney traffic is heavy I give you that, but at least you guys can drive and are courteous. I didn't mind Sydney traffic actually. People go when they should and they let you in. In Perth they'll try and t bone you.

Also with the 3 light thing (at 1.30pm in the arvo, technically not peak hour), the roads are often designed to put a set of traffic lights within 200-300m of the next. I used to work in the engineering department of a local council and that was considered bad design practice, yet that's exactly what they've done here.

But you can laugh. We haven't had tumble weed and kangaroos in the main street since the 1850's.

yes some seem to have different driving idea`s in Perth, i did a stretch working for a farmer over there some years ago, the farmer was quite perplexed when i stopped at an uncontrolled intersection to see there was nothing coming the other way .

[Rodp]

Originally Posted by TMC

Sydney traffic is heavy I give you that, but at least you guys can drive and are courteous. I didn't mind Sydney traffic actually. People go when they should and they let you in. In Perth they'll try and t bone you.

I'd love to know which mystical part of Sydney you're talking about..? Either that or Perth has turned into the Thunderdome since the last time I was there.

A mate of mine who has a Hybrid Camry returns excellent economy results driving along the Motorway of a morning - most of the time it's on battery due to the staggering speed you're able to obtain.

Would stop/start option have helped me this morning? Possibly. Spent a lot of time stopped in my 1.5 hour, 18km trek into the City. I'd have thought the money saved would be spent later down the track on wear and tear..?

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

But back to the aircon, we are (or at least used to be) spoilt by quite effective aircon systems in our Falcons, unlike those I've experienced in European cars. So will there be some compromise there so smaller compressors are used? One thing that attracted me to the Falcon was the fantastic aircon, especially in the AU Fairmont.

Anyone who has experience with European built or European designed cars can tell you one thing, the Aircon on all these cars is like an emphasema sufferer blowing air at you through a straw.

They have a bangin' heater though.

My Fiesta only has about 395 grams of gas, the aircon is horrible, pretty much non existant, when I was driving it daily I used to let it idle for an hour with the aircon going and the fan on full before I left work, to cool the thing down sufficiently, even then driving home, if it was about 25 degrees it would really struggle.

The Focus is a bit better, but its still crap, 30 degree day it won't do much, not sure of its gas capacity. I've had it on with outside temperature on around 13 degrees and I still won't feel that cold to warrant turning it off.

The Mercedes Sprinters we deal with at work have two systems on one compressor, rear aircon and front aircon, only 800 grams of gas in the entire system, its hopeless too.

My Falcon, best damn aircon I've ever experienced, its like a freezer in the damn thing, 1KG gas capacity though.

Territory is really good too.

[OzJavelin]

My Javelins have had stop-start technology for years ... Largely unintentional stopping and hard starting

originally I thought this sounded like a stupid idea, but I suppose wew just have faith that it's been tested and will work ok ..

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

I wouldnt read into it too much, that's just Carpoint's speculating, 8 speed ZF won't appear until the 2014 update if at all and auto stop-start would need to be across the range, not just one engine type.

They could implement EPAS across the range and an electric water pump for better efficiency than stop-start tech.

Ford have already said they will be switching to the gen II ZF 6 speed in 2014, for a 2-3% economy benefit, so forget the 8 speed, its not happening.

Ford have actually already stated what they will do for economy in 2014, the upgraded auto, better aero and low rolling resistant tyres, probably the same type used on the Ecoboost, for a 7-8% economy improvement, so there's really no need to speculate because the info is already out there. I wouldn't expect them to even touch the engines.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Rodp

I'd love to know which mystical part of Sydney you're talking about..? Either that or Perth has turned into the Thunderdome since the last time I was there.

You could be forgiven for thinking that, yes.

Perth motorists are awful. Rude, inconsiderate, dangerous and incompetent, all rolled into one. Favourite games of Motoristis Perthies species is race to the merge point and speed up to stop him from changing lanes and of course, that evergreen favourite, run the red.

And with no land to build new infrastucture on, and no infrastructure planned anyway, this place is going to be an absolute disaster of a place to do anything in 10 years time.

[ivorya]

I find it funny that everyone is complaining about it but it's not even here yet.

It's just another feature that Ford can premote, hopefully sell more cars to city people and stop us internet-nerds complaining about the company being always late with new technologies.

[1TUFFUTE]

ill tell you one thing...at least we knowif ford do release this it will be done and ready for the market...some brands have had bad stop start tech for years....

[mik]

i reckon if any engine could do the stop start thing it`s the inline six, i pulled an Au engine apart a while ago with plenty of miles on it, and the bottom end was like new, truly it looked like it would do another 10 years service no problems.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Brazen

I thought it was referring to the Ecoboost not EcoLPI

i believe you are correct. thread title needs changing.

[2011G6E]

Don't get me wrong...i'm always impressed by new technology like stop-start, cylinder shut down (like the Chrysler Hemi and Holden V8), and things like that...its great that they are squeezing more and more economy out of engines.

...but is it just me or do you think they are great now on brand new cars...but kind of worry what they will be like in five or ten years time as second handers, given the average level of abuse and lack of maintainance that the average car undergoes...?

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

http://www.carsales.com.au/news/2012...r-falcon-29927

Some more related articles to this one which are fascinating reading. Especially about the 1.0L EcoBoost, and what the 2.0L could be looking at upgrades wise.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Ford have already said they will be switching to the gen II ZF 6 speed in 2014, for a 2-3% economy benefit, so forget the 8 speed, its not happening.

Ford have actually already stated what they will do for economy in 2014, the upgraded auto, better aero and low rolling resistant tyres, probably the same type used on the Ecoboost, for a 7-8% economy improvement, so there's really no need to speculate because the info is already out there. I wouldn't expect them to even touch the engines.

The same things Holden is planning for VF except their target is 7% improvement which will take
the SIDI 3.0 V6 down around 8.3 l/100km and the SIDI 3.6 V6 to around 8.5 l/100 km l/100 km...

[Bossxr8]

Holden are also targeting weight reduction with an aluminium bonnet etc, something Ford won't be doing.

[Mr Hardware]

wait, are you guys really praising AU falcon aircon? are you kidding?

take a ride in a mid 90's widebody camry and then you'll learn what truly good aircon is like.

i can't believe that there's been a ford made in the last decade that has worse aircon than an AU?

[FG50T]

Stop start can be annoying at times. A bit hessitant from experience but it does save fuel and emissions! My instant fuel economy drops from 2.0l in drive to 1.5l in neutral so I always do that at lights..On a sidenot the FG A/C is already the weakest I've ever experienced so it can't possibly get any worse

[TMC]

Originally Posted by Rodp

I'd love to know which mystical part of Sydney you're talking about..? Either that or Perth has turned into the Thunderdome since the last time I was there.

Annandale, Glebe, Sydney itself. Heavy traffic yes, but courteous nonetheless, even in peak. Hesitate and you've had it though. You go as soon as there is a gap in Sydney and that's good. I like driving like that. If you're asleep and sit at the lights for more than a second longer than reasonable you get a light toot on the horn. Nothing really irate, just a friendly wake up.

Now for Thunderdome Perth. People can't drive. They either pull out in front of you, or expect a 30km gap and wait an hour to pullout. People love to start fights. Everyones getting their pride hurt and taking everything WAY too seriously. You don't get a polite toot. You get a fully seated horn blast, a heap of abuse, and in some cases they'll get out the car at the lights, yell through the open drivers window a heap of abuse then punch the panels as they walk away. And their the guys in business suits. I've seen it many times. People are either stoned, drunk, mental, suicidal, or asleep, or all of the above on the roads in Perth. I'm glad we don't have easy to get guns here, or we'd be LA.

Now as regards stop/start EcoLPi, as long as the air con still worked, at least you'd be saving money while society goes down the plug hole in front of you at a red light.

[TMC]

Originally Posted by FG50T

My instant fuel economy drops from 2.0l in drive to 1.5l in neutral so I always do that at lights..

That is a good idea. I've never thought of that before.

[Yellow_Festiva]

I don't think the wear and tear will be any more than 'normal' on a modern engine, especially if it has been designed with this technology in mind. Think of the cars going around that do this anyway such as taxi's, courier vans etc.

It will save petrol in certain driving conditions. I used to live in an area where there was a long slightly downhill stretch that was always crawling in the morning. I would often turn the car off and roll down in neutral at a snails pace for several minutes. After a few jabs of the brake pedal it used to go hard and would often take a lot of effort to stop the car, but when you were doing 3km /h that was hardly a problem. Didn't have power steering so that wasn't effected.

I wasn't the only one doing it either... you would often see a crawling car all of a sudden nose dive - the drivers were coasting along pressing the brake full force and the brake pump would kick in upon starting, increasing pressure and locking up the wheels!

The air-con issue... I don't mind the air-con in my Focus, actually think it is too cold as I often need to turn it off and re-circulate the air for a few minutes to gradually increase the temp - even when the fan is on the lowest setting...... sort of like a manual 'economy' mode. I'm not a fan of using the air-con for anything other than cold - if I need heat thats what the engine is for!

So, if this stop start technology is so 'smart' why can't a system be integrated into the works that turns the air-con automatically to re-circulate when the engine turns off?? If the cabin is already cold it will take a few minutes for the air to gradually increase in temp by a few degrees, by which time the car would have taken off again, activating the air-con and chilling the air back to the set temp??

This will remove the need to electronically driven air-con??? Would be better than totally off I would imagine?

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

/snip

This will remove the need to electronically driven air-con??? Would be better than totally off I would imagine?

Most hybrid's already have electric driven accesories, like A/C pumps...

And the cars that still have belt driven A/C compressors will not stop the engine if the current drain is at a certain point.


Its funny, most peoples fears about Stop/start, engine ware and battery drain are already put to rest...

So there is nothing to fear