Calls For Further Speed Limit Reductions.

[Maggot]

THe problem is people doing 70 in a 50 zone.. we might as well have poeple doing 50 in a 30.

If anyone actually stuck to 50 in 50 zones.. there would be almost no pedestrian deaths in those areas.. other than drunk pedestians that is.

I wonder if progressively quieter cars has any effect??

[ltd_on20s]

the unfortunate thing with pollies is that they appeal to the lowest common denominator. scruby gets airtime? hell give him what he wants and he will go away thats their logic. keeps them in a job and the heat off their backs. a motoring enthusiast NEEDS to be elected as an independant to get in their face. its a lot harder for them to get one of their own to shut up then it is someone like scruby and co. and where the hell do these "experts" on road saftey come from? sweden is nothing like Australia. a couple of hours drive and your over the border there driving how you feel.

as for the stats re deaths in the NT going up over the past few years, the silence from pollies should prove to you that THEY DO NOT CARE wether you live or die.the only time they care is when a parent or a "expert" pipes up, and a kneejerk reaction takes places to tighten the screws. if they did care one would come out and say "this isnt working". and why should they say anything of the sort when its a nice little cash cow for them. the amount the country makes from fines far exceeds what they hand out in either bodily injuries or back into roads and road saftey

the funny thing is, the motorist is the single largest voting block in the country. it wouldnt be that hard for someone savvvy to put his hand up and hop onto all the forums and get the majority to vote him in as an independant AT FEDERAL LEVEL. forget state because you cant comment on eg the NT when you live in SA. Federal you can fire up as much as you like.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by ltd_on20s

the funny thing is, the motorist is the single largest voting block in the country. it wouldnt be that hard for someone savvvy to put his hand up and hop onto all the forums and get the majority to vote him in as an independant AT FEDERAL LEVEL. forget state because you cant comment on eg the NT when you live in SA. Federal you can fire up as much as you like.

You would need one person from every state to do this.

[dom_105]

Originally Posted by flappist

Join the party. Then you can actually vote. According to the BBS AFF has over 46000 members. That is more than the total membership of the Labor, Liberal & National parties combined.

And another as much, I would guess, on LS1

On a similar track, A lobby group representing car clubs, and sites like this, and people like us, with membership at the very least in the tens of thousands, now that would be something. Sure would beat screw loose Scruby and his fax machine.

Maybe it is food for thought for people on here more well-connected in the car scene than my good self.

[yanknbank]

Originally Posted by ltd_on20s

the funny thing is, the motorist is the single largest voting block in the countryas you like.

Correct. Next time you hear of some idiotic piece of legislation being formulated by the government, ring you're local member, especially if you happen to live in a marginal seat and suggest to him (or her) that if he even thinks about sticking up his hand in the chamber and supporting it he can stick your vote where the sun never shines. It's about the only thing they understand enough to get them to take some sort of action.
As an example, you only have to look at how quickly the Federal government acted when the population at large rebelled about petrol pricing.

[Buddy 1]

Originally Posted by Nikked

So they punish drivers, because pedestrians can't look both ways, let alone use a zebra crossing? Pedestrians are stupid, the cant walk an extra 5 meters to a crossing, so they dart out in front of cars, stupidly hiding behind parked cars. Yet, you'll get a dirty look if you nearly (or come too close to them) hit them.

I Agree with what you have said as it Happens all the Time & it is Only Because of Many People being Rude or Stupid or Both!

I Always use a Crossing even if I Have to Walk a bit Further & if I cannot Find a Crossing then I will cross the Road after looking both ways a few times & letting the Cars go through as the Road is for cars & not pedestrians!

I even will wait at a Crossing & let a few Cars through instead of just walking straight out in front of a vehicle that is only a few metres away & cross after them when there is a Gap before the next Vehicle.

Why do I do all this, because I do not wish to be run over & because I have some Courtesy & understand the road is for Cars Mainly & we Walking People have to give way to them.

Maybe I am just Smarter than most?

As for Lowering the Speed Limit, it would depend where as the inner City Centres should not have Cars in them at all in my Opinion & yes the speed limits there should be like 30 Kmh if you must allow cars in them.

Out of the main centre 50 is Fine & on the Hwy think they should lower the limit to 80, yes I know this sounds like I am a wowser (I am not) however can see the merit of all Highways having lower Limits as a way to save Lives.

And if you start to feel tired because you find 80 boring or your travel time will increase slightly, have more breaks

[ltd_on20s]

Originally Posted by Buddy 1

As for Lowering the Speed Limit, it would depend where as the inner City Centres should not have Cars in them at all in my Opinion & yes the speed limits there should be like 30 Kmh if you must allow cars in them.

Out of the main centre 50 is Fine & on the Hwy think they should lower the limit to 80, yes I know this sounds like I am a wowser (I am not) however can see the merit of all Highways having lower Limits as a way to save Lives.

its been proven that lower speeds on longer stretches of road increas drowsiness and boredom. more breaks isnt the answer, hell it would take an extra 4 hours to get to melbourne from adelaide. thats four more hours to e knackered in.

30kph? why then allow ay cars into teh CBD when the common push bike can do 35 kph on average? i know tbecause i ride, and average about 35 40 kph thru the city.

again comes down to common sense. ur smashed and come out infront of a car? youor fault buddy. dont lok both ways before crossing? your fault buddy

[XWGT]

Some statistics gleaned from another forum

Of the pedestrians killed...........one third where drunk
While 2008 (59) was a 40% increase in pedestrian deaths in Victoria, it appears 2007 was a freak year (41), and 2008 was almost identical to 2006. (58)

[Fev]

what kind of sane person would reccomend lowering it to 30km/hr?

Leave it be - we're cleaning out the gene-pool and enforcing Darwins theory of survival of the fittest!

[Keepleft]

Signal.

1. NSW will *not* reduce the built-up area default speed limit further.

2. At most, Sydney CBD, Wollongong CBD, Newcastle CBD, and by application to states authority (RTA) - rural towns *could* apply for a reduced 20-40km/h limit for CBD's only.

3. I do expect the 100km/h rural default speed-limit to drop, in time. A work in progress.

4. NT - CLP, as at January 2009 - remain committed to (//) for the Stuart Highway to replace the 130km/h limit in order to reduce current toll outcome.

5. NSW is trialling on the F3 a 'gatelock' crash barrier at a couple of "Emergency Services Only U-Turn Bays". If successful, the system would rollout to most all of these X-over points. This measure would allow the consideration of a speed-limit higher than 110km/h.

That is all.

(NB - Gidday Jack).

[Fev]

5. NSW is trialling on the F3 a 'gatelock' crash barrier at a couple of "Emergency Services Only U-Turn Bays". If successful, the system would rollout to most all of these X-over points. This measure would allow the consideration of a speed-limit higher than 110km/h.

what do you mean by this? brains not switched on enough this mornin

[GS608]

Originally Posted by Fev

what do you mean by this? brains not switched on enough this mornin

im only guessing here but it may be a barrier that runs flush with the existing barriers, therefor no risk of merging into the big metal u shaped barrier ?
not sure how the NSW barriers work so just a guess.

[Daymoe]

Originally Posted by flappist

Stop whinging and DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.

These academic drop kicks do not have any special powers. You can lobby your MP just as much as they can.

Join the party. Then you can actually vote. According to the BBS AFF has over 46000 members. That is more than the total membership of the Labor, Liberal & National parties combined.
If we all joined then WE would control ALL state and federal road rules.....that it how it works.

Unfortunately the majority of AFF members prefer to whinge and do nothing because that is easy so we are probably stuffed.....

Should start up our own political group, then vote for ourselfs at election day LOL.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Daymoe

Should start up our own political group, then vote for ourselfs at election day LOL.

That will never work.

The majority of voters in Australia have no idea whatsoever of how the political process works and will just vote for whatever regardless of any issues.

My dad voted X so I vote X.

X are bastards but Y will be worse so I will vote X.

The only way to have any input is to be part of X or Y or Z.

I live/work in a X area so I vote X.

To make it simpler to understand.

When Ford made the AU in 1998, the ugliest falcon ever, how many here bought holdens in protest?
How many still think that they were not ugly and that Ford can do no wrong?
How many bought AUs and just hoped that one day they would make a less ugly car?
How many whinge and complain about all the things wrong with falcons etc yet still buy them every time?
How many will still buy Ford if they make them FWD and N/A V6 only because Ford can do no wrong and they could NEVER buy a holden under any circumstances not even just once as a protest because it is JUST PLAIN WRONG?

If, on the other hand, AFF had majority shareholding in FoA and controlled design what would the 2010 twin turbo 11 second factory GTHO have as options?

This is how the political system in Australia works...........

[Buddy 1]

Originally Posted by ltd_on20s

its been proven that lower speeds on longer stretches of road increas drowsiness and boredom. more breaks isnt the answer, hell it would take an extra 4 hours to get to melbourne from adelaide. thats four more hours to e knackered in.

30kph? why then allow ay cars into teh CBD when the common push bike can do 35 kph on average? i know tbecause i ride, and average about 35 40 kph thru the city.

again comes down to common sense. ur smashed and come out infront of a car? youor fault buddy. dont lok both ways before crossing? your fault buddy

ok so lets look at your extra 4 Hours from Melbourne to Adelaide

Using this Site it worked out to be an Extra 1.5 Hours Travel Time & not 4

http://www.roadmapaustralia.com.au/

And that is assuming you could do 100 KMH all the way when in Fact you cannot as you will have slower Drivers, slower speed Zones & Towns to travel through so the real Differance may be more like an Hour (if that) if you were to pass all Slower Drivers in a short amount of time.

Yes stopping for 15 or so Minutes & having a Drink & a walk does make a Huge Differance.

Yes I agree all Vehicles as we know them now should be kept out of the CBD's & we could walk or even Use the Inner City vehicles like say Smart cars that will be for Hire to use at the 30k speed Limit to go those few Blocks if we cannot be bothered Walking & getting some Exercise.

Not to mention the Light Rail which would be Common if all the Cars of Today were not allowed into the CBD.

Or as you say have a Fold up Pushbike in our Boot & use it to go those few CBD Blocks :

Lastly I agree with your Comments Re People walking out on the road in front of vehicles, they should not do it, Roads are for Cars unless it is a Mall in the CBD

Things in the Future will Change & the things I have Mentioned will happen & you will not Die because of it, in fact you may just Live Longer.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by flappist

When Ford made the AU in 1998, the ugliest falcon ever, how many here bought holdens in protest?If, on the other hand, AFF had majority shareholding in FoA and controlled design what would the 2010 twin turbo 11 second factory GTHO have as options?

This is how the political system in Australia works...........

I bought a Magna! First time EVER I drove a 'non' Ford (except the Mrs's)

....... and only 11 seconds????? ..... ppppfffft!

Biggest problem I see it is that too many just accept the situation .... "Don't speed and you won't get flashed" ..... mentallity in Vic. Its never on the agenda at election time ..... and the LIB's, even though they have always said they will revert back to 10%, are so lame at oppostion they wont have the chance to impliment it here for many many years to come!



| [/url] |

[ltd_on20s]

Originally Posted by Buddy 1

ok so lets look at your extra 4 Hours from Melbourne to Adelaide

Using this Site it worked out to be an Extra 1.5 Hours Travel Time & not 4

http://www.roadmapaustralia.com.au/

And that is assuming you could do 100 KMH all the way when in Fact you cannot as you will have slower Drivers, slower speed Zones & Towns to travel through so the real Differance may be more like an Hour (if that) if you were to pass all Slower Drivers in a short amount of time.

Yes stopping for 15 or so Minutes & having a Drink & a walk does make a Huge Differance.

so maybe i was off on my point of times by a bit. in SA you can do 110on the highway, and when you get to the vic border it goes to 100. but can you imagine 700 klms at 80kph? how many more people will fall asleep at the wheel? truck drivers? couriers?. its not common sense that in the past 50 years worth of car modernisation that we should be going backwards and going slower.

if anything all highways should be made duel carriageways and the speed limit increased.

as for keeping cars out of the cbd...

"A large number of European towns and cities have made part of their centres car-free since the early 1960s. These are often accompanied by car parks on the edge of the pedestrianised zone, and, in the larger cases, park and ride schemes. Central Copenhagen is one of the largest and oldest examples: the auto-free zone is centered on Strøget, a pedestrian shopping street, which is in fact not a single street but a series of interconnected avenues which create a very large auto-free zone, although it is crossed in places by streets with vehicular traffic. Most of these zones allow delivery trucks to service the businesses located there during the early morning, and street-cleaning vehicles will usually go through these streets after most shops have closed for the night."

a quick note, none of these citys that do this look remotely like our cities. our cities were built with road use in mind.. plus the govt caters for the people with park and ride schemes etc. our public transport is a shambles. you cant use the "euro" idea on Australian cities because they are not layed out the same way, unless of course the govt will pay for parking outside the cbd and cheap bike and segway hire......dont see that happening tho

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by auslandau

I bought a Magna! First time EVER I drove a 'non' Ford (except the Mrs's)

....... and only 11 seconds????? ..... ppppfffft!

Biggest problem I see it is that too many just accept the situation .... "Don't speed and you won't get flashed" ..... mentallity in Vic. Its never on the agenda at election time ..... and the LIB's, even though they have always said they will revert back to 10%, are so lame at oppostion they wont have the chance to impliment it here for many many years to come!

I don't know about that, brumby is doing a decent job of campaigning for them!!!

[flappist]

Originally Posted by auslandau

I bought a Magna! First time EVER I drove a 'non' Ford (except the Mrs's)

....... and only 11 seconds????? ..... ppppfffft!

Biggest problem I see it is that too many just accept the situation .... "Don't speed and you won't get flashed" ..... mentallity in Vic. Its never on the agenda at election time ..... and the LIB's, even though they have always said they will revert back to 10%, are so lame at oppostion they wont have the chance to impliment it here for many many years to come!

So don't vote out the incumbent, join it.......Then you are already in power aren't you

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

I don't know about that, brumby is doing a decent job of campaigning for them!!!

Yep, the LIBS won't 'win' the next election but Labor may loose it

But alas I digress ......... political discussions are not healthy

Originally Posted by Flappist

So don't vote out the incumbent, join it.......Then you are already in power aren't you

What! And take a pay cut!!!

Yes I know what you are saying but its easier to whinge than actually do something about it.



| [/url] |

[The G6ET Spot]

Originally Posted by Keepleft

Signal.

This measure would allow the consideration of a speed-limit higher than 110km/h.

That would never happen, not in NSW. They would lose too much revenue.

And contrary to what they all say that is all they worry about.

My 2c

[XY GS]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Very young children just can't be expected to know or understand road safety enough to be totally trusted, and they can take off in a heart beat........

I've only ever had old people wander across in front of me. Of course, I usually avoid school zones whenever I can. It's always oldies wandering across. Once, I was driving in a 40km/h zone because of 'mixed traffic', and some old lady decided she'd stop in the middle of the road to have a look in her purse. I had to stop, which wasn't a problem, but after honking 3 times she still didn't move. The motorbike behind me got annoyed and went flying around me, only to nearly wipe her out himself.

[bennyk351]

As to speed limits in NT outback Jack summed it up nothing changed by changing the speed limit it only got worse Maybe try to educate the aborigenies to stop their activities, they would at least half the deaths in the NT,maybe im right , :sm_headba :sm_headba :sm_headba maybe not

[Steve]

Whilst I think that even 50 is too fast for some streets, I think the majority of the blame rests with the pedestrians. Pedestrian education is the key. Whilst not wanting to turn this into a racial slur, I too grew up with the "look right, look left, look right again" campaign on tv and learnt to respect traffic and understand the effect a moving car can have on me. The area I work in has a VERY high migrant population, probably less than 5 yrs in the country, and they seem to have virtually no regard to road rules. We get people crossing wherever they want, walk in the gutter of a dual lane road and stand in the middle of a busy road amongst other things. We've had two pedestrian deaths in twelve months within 50 metres of a crossing.
FFS, educate people, spend as much money on that as you do on "wipe off 5" campaigns and the results will follow.

[ltd_on20s]

Originally Posted by Steve

Whilst I think that even 50 is too fast for some streets, I think the majority of the blame rests with the pedestrians. Pedestrian education is the key. Whilst not wanting to turn this into a racial slur, I too grew up with the "look right, look left, look right again" campaign on tv and learnt to respect traffic and understand the effect a moving car can have on me. The area I work in has a VERY high migrant population, probably less than 5 yrs in the country, and they seem to have virtually no regard to road rules. We get people crossing wherever they want, walk in the gutter of a dual lane road and stand in the middle of a busy road amongst other things. We've had two pedestrian deaths in twelve months within 50 metres of a crossing.
FFS, educate people, spend as much money on that as you do on "wipe off 5" campaigns and the results will follow.

sorry mate. too hard for current govt's. much easier to make money from people going 4k/hr over the speed limit

maybe if they put some cops on the street for a week and fined everyong for jay walking(i think the rule for jaywalking is not using the crosswalk when within 20 meters of a crossing) pedestrians would start to think. but why fine someone 25$ when you can fine them $120?

again this comes to personal responsibility. plus when ped's start to know cars are going even slower they will start to take even more risks.

[chevypower]

They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin

[mrbaxr6t]

hmmkay :

here there is a shopping street that is deemed "shared zone" and the speed limit is 10kmh on this strip with pedestrians having equal rights as cars, both coexisting on the road etc... THIS type of thing imho desensitizes pedestrians to the dangers of meandering out on the road at their leisure. Also one day a police officer sat on the side the street in full uniform with a radar it looked like he was having a field day. My car at idle not touching pedals rolls on flat ground at about 15kmh - so with zero throttle and zero brake I am speeding, and it seems so was many others. - As for joining a political party does the guy who suggested it belong to one? Since when did politicians pay attention to what we have to say anyway?

Nobody has touched on the trauma a driver suffers from hitting a pedestrian, regardless of who was at fault the driver will suffer for much time before they get over the fact they injured someone. As for alcohol being a contributing factor as pedestrians are intoxicated and wind up getting hit we NEED to change our behavior, How many times do you see a group of guys giving each other lip because one is drinking light, or one isn't drinking as fast etc. This mindset that if you don't drink to excess you are a wimp or ... erm several other terms, needs to stop and stop now. Medically speaking at MOST an average male should drink is a 6 pack of heavy beer, and even that is being overly generous, but these people that are dying drink far more than that.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by mrbaxr6t

As for joining a political party does the guy who suggested it belong to one? Since when did politicians pay attention to what we have to say anyway?

Yes I do, and having spent time voting on policy committees YES THEY DO.

[ltd_on20s]

Originally Posted by flappist

Yes I do, and having spent time voting on policy committees YES THEY DO.

then WHY after 20 years of knowing that they need to totally overhaul most of our road rules, change driver attittude, knowing that people ae sick of them putting a camera where no accidents ever occur, knowing that them putting a speed limit in the NT has actually raised death rates, having a truckload of reports stating that our system is broken do they continually, lie, cheat, deceit,and plain misuse the data for their own adgenda, knowing fll well people have died?

why hasnt there been an enquiry into why death rates have gone up in NT?

why hasnt there been a enquiry in to pedestrain deaths? do they know full well its pedestrain idocy at the heart of the problem?

why have speed limits gradually decreased when people are driving a lot more and apprantly better/roads/cars/saftey devices etc?

simply because the lowest common denominator is there objective. the quick easy way out.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by ltd_on20s

then WHY after 20 years of knowing that they need to totally overhaul most of our road rules, change driver attittude, knowing that people ae sick of them putting a camera where no accidents ever occur, knowing that them putting a speed limit in the NT has actually raised death rates, having a truckload of reports stating that our system is broken do they continually, lie, cheat, deceit,and plain misuse the data for their own adgenda, knowing fll well people have died?

why hasnt there been an enquiry into why death rates have gone up in NT?

why hasnt there been a enquiry in to pedestrain deaths? do they know full well its pedestrain idocy at the heart of the problem?

why have speed limits gradually decreased when people are driving a lot more and apprantly better/roads/cars/saftey devices etc?

simply because the lowest common denominator is there objective. the quick easy way out.

Because not enough ordinary people care enough about it to actually try and do something, they just whinge and complain of internet forums
Lobby groups only have power when no one disagrees with them.

NT's data in too new and will be considered a blip for a while. Remember the mob that brought it are still in power as are their federal buddies so who is going to finance the inquiry?

Warning, if this thread goes political it will go splat.