Russia v Ukraine - Page 21

PhilT2 · 15-04-2022, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T3rminator

There has been a lot of conjecture on who is winning or losing. This is a must watch. Won't hear this type of analysis anywhere else.

Was posted 2 weeks ago but still relevant.

I have to admit being a bit biased against that guy, something to do with his interest in underage girls. Doesn't mean he is wrong of course. Here is a different point of view on whether the attack on Kiev was just a diversion. He gives some evidence to back up his opinion which make more sense to me but judge for yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVPIOwmWNpE
Beau also disagrees with Ritter about whether Russia could have taken out the Ukrainian president if they had wanted to. Again I think he makes more sense going by the example of how long it took the US to take out Bin Laden (10 yrs)
I'm also more inclined to support his estimate of Russian military capacity. It's not what it was in the Soviet days. For example that ship that was damaged/caught fire is listed as the "flagshp" of the Black Sea fleet; it's a 40 yr old cruiser of 12,000 tons. I'm inclined to believe it just caught fire.
Many of the Russian tanks seem to be of similar age so the stories of them breaking down and being abandoned make sense.
There's another story of a Russian drone that was was captured and was found to contain a standard DSLR Canon attached with velcro. If true, that indicates not all Russian gear is high tech.
I'm sticking with the view that this may drag on for years.

**FairmontGS** · 15-04-2022, 08:41 AM

Day 50

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/...-sunk-liveblog

Ukraine's postal service announces it'll release a commemorative 'Russian warship, go f#ck yourself' stamp

https://www.businessinsider.com/ukra...f-stamp-2022-3

T3rminator · 15-04-2022, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhilT2

Beau also disagrees with Ritter about whether Russia could have taken out the Ukrainian president if they had wanted to. Again I think he makes more sense going by the example of how long it took the US to take out Bin Laden (10 yrs)

The US didn't know where Bin Laden was, there were lots of speculations and "intelligence", and they bombed the crap out of locations suspected of harbouring him.

The Russians know where Zelenskyy is. He has been taking the EU leader and Bojo for tours in the "hot spots". It wouldn't take much to send a hypersonic missile down that way, but now that would really start WW3.

Ritter's past is interesting. I agree with him that we are all just speculating based on ~~mis~~information being fed to us. I'm watching this thing with eyes wide open, and can't help but lean towards believing people who have experience in the field and who can present logical analysis, over journos.

Mulva · 15-04-2022, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T3rminator

...Ritter's past is interesting. I agree with him that we are all just speculating based on ~~mis~~information being fed to us. I'm watching this thing with eyes wide open, and can't help but lean towards believing people who have experience in the field and who can present logical analysis, over journos.

Problem is you will find a large number of people with as much and more experience than him, that also present logical analysis, and they hold entirely different opinions to him.

Doesn't mean he is wrong and they are right - just means that even those that should know don't know...well, not all of those that should know agree with one another.

Mulva · 15-04-2022, 12:42 PM

You sank my battleship!!

**FairmontGS** · 15-04-2022, 01:10 PM

Putin's campaign is just starting to look like a complete joke now. You'd laugh out loud if it weren't for the people suffering and dying.

T3rminator · 15-04-2022, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulva

Problem is you will find a large number of people with as much and more experience than him, that also present logical analysis, and they hold entirely different opinions to him.

Doesn't mean he is wrong and they are right - just means that even those that should know don't know...well, not all of those that should know agree with one another.

Agree with you there, that there will be others with credentials who will have opposing views, and worth listening to, but gees they are hard to find. Post them up!

I'm yet to come across anyone who has his levels of ties though i.e family in the region (understand the politics), recruited into the marines with the purpose of studying and forming intelligence on the soviets etc.

He caught my attention because some of what he states collaborates with other on the ground sources i.e. Interview with residents.* Go back and have a look at the train station that was hit, in the back ground you can see artillery set up. Just supports the stuff he has been saying regarding human shield.

Listen to what he said about mariupol, posted 2 weeks ago, and what's happening now?

He is not always right, I disagree with what he said about Putin not playing information warfare....obviously.

**DJR-351** · 15-04-2022, 02:56 PM

Plenty more of Mr Ritters views here.......

https://www.rt.com/search?q=Scott+Ritter&type=

.....leaving aside the underage girl's stuff, it's hard to take his comments as unbiased knowing whom one of his paymasters is, and after reading some of his articles, it's hard not to believe he has a massive ax to grind with his own country, I especially found interesting the piece on his disappointment with the demise of the Soviet Union.

T3rminator · 15-04-2022, 05:33 PM

One of the profile description has him listed as a "US critic". It appears his WMD revelation and vocal anti IRAQ invasion stance got him black listed a long time ago. I'm surprised its taken so long for people to bring up his past.

The questions you need to ask are a) are they qualified to make the call that they have made b) are there independent sources and evidence that collaborate with what they have said. If the answers to those questions are Yes, time and time again, then better start taking notice.

When it comes to this topic, its a little irrelevant whether people like them or think they are of good character. This goes for any expert / analyst / professor. Each will have their own bias.

**FairmontGS** · 15-04-2022, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulva

Problem is you will find a large number of people with as much and more experience than him, that also present logical analysis, and they hold entirely different opinions to him.

Doesn't mean he is wrong and they are right - just means that even those that should know don't know...well, not all of those that should know agree with one another.

I find it an easy exercise sorting the wheat from the chaff. Not sure why others seem to continually scuttle down the rabbit holes....

Anyhoo, it goes like this - if the person put forward has any sound academic credentials that would recommend them as a reliable expert source then they'd have been regularly cited in the media as required.

This guy hasn't been cited. Ergo, he's a nut-job. Simples.

xkxlxm · 15-04-2022, 07:21 PM

"his WMD revelation and vocal anti IRAQ invasion stance got him black listed a long time ago"

"if the person put forward has any sound academic credentials that would recommend them as a reliable expert source then they'd have been regularly cited in the media as required." - this reminds me of that reliable, proven, knowledgeable, trustworthy expert Paul Wolfowitz who must have been on mainstream media almost nightly back when mainstream media was helping the US, the UK and Australia build the case for the invasion of Iraq in 2003.

PhilT2 · 15-04-2022, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xkxlxm

"his WMD revelation and vocal anti IRAQ invasion stance got him black listed a long time ago"

I thought it might have been the "violent sex offender" label; that will usually get you blacklisted. While that does not make his opinions invalid the fact that he got caught in an undercover sting not once but three times makes me believe he may not be the sharpest tool in the shed.

CoupeKing · 15-04-2022, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

sorting the wheat from the chaff.

That's what covid did.

I'm glad I stood my ground.

T3rminator · 15-04-2022, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FairmontGS

Anyhoo, it goes like this - if the person put forward has any sound academic credentials that would recommend them as a reliable expert source then they'd have been regularly cited in the media as required.

Hello!!

MITCHAY · 15-04-2022, 08:33 PM

Tucker Carlson. Worked for CNN, PBS, and MSNBC before going to Fox

He sounds and looks like a dumb ****

zilo · 16-04-2022, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JasonACT

Then... welcome to the best country on the planet. Something I hope we both believe. A place where a beaten and battered partner can leave their abuser and take out an effective restraining order.

No such thing as an effective restraining order in Australia.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...save-them.html

PhilT2 · 16-04-2022, 03:13 PM

Russia may be about to default on loan repayments because they attempted to make the payment in rubles instead of US$ as the contract requires.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/14/b...lt-moodys.html

I didn't expect that the sanctions would be taking effect this soon.

Itsme · 16-04-2022, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zilo

No such thing as an effective restraining order in Australia.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...save-them.html

For some maybe not but for others there is effective restraining orders and I'm talking from experience.

Chrysler · 16-04-2022, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhilT2

For example that ship that was damaged/caught fire is listed as the "flagshp" of the Black Sea fleet; it's a 40 yr old cruiser of 12,000 tons. I'm inclined to believe it just caught fire.

The pride of the Russian Black Sea Fleet just happened to "catch fire" in the middle of a conflict with an advanced drone and anti-ship missile armed Ukraine off its coast. What a coincidence!

Those R-360 Neptune missile have only been in service since last year and are based on a comparatively modern Russian design. They appear more than capable of sinking a Russian ship that stores most of its munitions on-deck.

Of course, we can all believe what Russia says all of the time: there is no war in Ukraine, it's just a military exercise in Belarus. Russia has no intention of invading Ukraine.

And let's not forget that even though the Moskva sank due to an innocuous fire onboard that had nothing to do with Ukraine distracting it with drones and firing multiple anti-ship missiles at it, Russia has just launched a revenge attack on Ukraine over its sinking!

So the sinking of Moskva had nothing to do with Ukraine, but Russia is stepping up its aggression in response anyway.

PhilT2 · 16-04-2022, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrysler

The pride of the Russian Black Sea Fleet just happened to "catch fire" in the middle of a conflict with an advanced drone and anti-ship missile armed Ukraine off its coast. What a coincidence!

I've since heard that the rest of the Russian fleet have moved much further out to sea, beyond the range of the missiles that they say didn't hit their ship, so I've changed my mind on that. Have to go with the evidence.

The Russian navy has a lot of bad luck. For example their only aircraft carrier went in for a refit in 2018. First a crane collapsed on it then it caught fire, then the floating dry dock it was in sank. Not expected to be back in service until next year.

Itsme · 16-04-2022, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chrysler

The pride of the Russian Black Sea Fleet just happened to "catch fire" in the middle of a conflict with an advanced drone and anti-ship missile armed Ukraine off its coast. What a coincidence!

Those R-360 Neptune missile have only been in service since last year and are based on a comparatively modern Russian design. They appear more than capable of sinking a Russian ship that stores most of its munitions on-deck.

Of course, we can all believe what Russia says all of the time: there is no war in Ukraine, it's just a military exercise in Belarus. Russia has no intention of invading Ukraine.

And let's not forget that even though the Moskva sank due to an innocuous fire onboard that had nothing to do with Ukraine distracting it with drones and firing multiple anti-ship missiles at it, Russia has just launched a revenge attack on Ukraine over its sinking!

So the sinking of Moskva had nothing to do with Ukraine, but Russia is stepping up its aggression in response anyway.

With peoples resolve to fight for their freedoms along with some high technology weaponry sure is proving itself in this war, I think Putin and his commanders are starting to realise this is not going to be some easy walk over of Ukraine.
Russia is suffering some significant losses and its pride has certainly been hurt.

MDS69 · 16-04-2022, 06:09 PM

Just a casual observer who is only getting my information from western media, it seems that just about 99% of Ukraine’s targets are the invaders inside their own borders ie military targets but Russia is reported as bombing hospitals, schools, residential, shopping centres etc with massive civilian casualties as well as military targets thrown in for good measure. Why isn’t the Ukraine sending a few missiles over the border in retaliation or will this inflame things beyond all get out. Why are all other countries only providing back door assistance and sanctions and not direct assistance. Will this start the rumoured WWIII. Send Russia back to the dark ages I say.

**FairmontGS** · 16-04-2022, 07:33 PM

Ukraine trolls Putin: ‘Can’t wait to scuba dive at sunken Russian warship site’

Quote:

Ukraine’s defence minister has mocked Russia over the sinking of its flagship warship Moskva which was believed to have been carrying up to 500 sailors.

Ukrainian Defence Minister Oleksii Reznikov tweeted on Friday that the sunken ship is now “a worthy diving site” he looks forward to visiting when the war ends.

“We have one more diving spot in the Black Sea now,” he wrote.

“Will definitely visit the wreck after our victory in the war. BTW, I already have 300 scuba dives.”

https://www.news.com.au/world/europe...e7350b14d72fc0

**mad2** · 16-04-2022, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MDS69

Just a casual observer who is only getting my information from western media, it seems that just about 99% of Ukraine’s targets are the invaders inside their own borders ie military targets but Russia is reported as bombing hospitals, schools, residential, shopping centres etc with massive civilian casualties as well as military targets thrown in for good measure. Why isn’t the Ukraine sending a few missiles over the border in retaliation or will this inflame things beyond all get out. Why are all other countries only providing back door assistance and sanctions and not direct assistance. Will this start the rumoured WWIII. Send Russia back to the dark ages I say.

easy answer ........... if they did lob a 'few' over to mother russia .. the 'freebies' would most likely dry up. and yes it is 'possible' that it 'could' happen.

Mulva · 16-04-2022, 08:30 PM

Putin paying a visit to the crew of the Moskva to lift morale

CoupeKing · 16-04-2022, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MDS69

Just a casual observer who is only getting my information from western media, it seems that just about 99% of Ukraine’s targets are the invaders inside their own borders ie military targets but Russia is reported as bombing hospitals, schools, residential, shopping centres etc with massive civilian casualties as well as military targets thrown in for good measure. Why isn’t the Ukraine sending a few missiles over the border in retaliation or will this inflame things beyond all get out. Why are all other countries only providing back door assistance and sanctions and not direct assistance. Will this start the rumoured WWIII. Send Russia back to the dark ages I say.

Keep digging.

It's all a distraction.