Faster then light

BHDOGS · 26-09-2011, 06:41 PM

With all the science threads on here and ive seen reference to it i thought id post it up and see what others think i personally have believed its possible all along how else would aliens get to us so fast

seriously tho if its true it means a whole rewrite of relativity

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/ipad/fas...-1226145082228

PHYSICISTS around the world expressed astonishment and skepticism in equal measure Friday after European scientists reported particles apparently traveling faster than light.

Tiny specks called neutrinos were clocked at 300,006 kilometers per second - slightly faster than the speed of light - along a 730km trajectory between the European Centre for Nuclear Research (CERN) in Switzerland and a laboratory in Italy.

If verified, the results would dismantle a key plank of Einstein's theory of relativity and deeply unsettle our understanding of the physical world.

fmc351 · 27-09-2011, 12:52 AM

60 nanoseconds quicker over the 700+km distance. Some of the possible answers to which the scientists suggest they have calculated for are curvature of the earth changes due to tides etc.

Im guessing, its likely there will be some form of error in the number. Be cool if it is true though.

BHDOGS · 27-09-2011, 01:21 AM

According to the article they went over there research for months before it was releasesd to make sure there was no errors and couldnt find any and now some japanese scientist are seeing if they can recreate it. And apparently there was another test done that hinted at faster then light travel from particles couple years ago but it wasnt conclusive enough.

Brendo_GSUte · 27-09-2011, 01:41 AM

what ever the difference between the neutrinos and light it seems to be negligible hence the "pouring" over the data. Its not inconcieveable though seems Einstein's theorys was based on what he discovered with his technology, deductions and awareness at the time. They will probably still come back and say lights still the quickest. I still say my XR8 is quicker....

As for the aliens they use time distortion with space folding thrown in for good measure by using an element called 115, They cant go faster than light otherwise you will never see them... oh wait thats why no one has seen an alien! haha

Iggypoppin' · 27-09-2011, 02:28 AM

I don't personally believe it but I'd like to think that in terms of physics, the laws can be proven wrong and open up a whole new world of research! Imagine that, pioneering the new "theory of relativity" etc.

fmc351 · 27-09-2011, 02:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BHDOGS

According to the article they went over there research for months before it was releasesd to make sure there was no errors and couldnt find any and now some japanese scientist are seeing if they can recreate it. And apparently there was another test done that hinted at faster then light travel from particles couple years ago but it wasnt conclusive enough.

Thus is the game of science, test, retest, knowledge, oh bugger, test, retest.

Im still betting on some kind of error. I read a cartoon in which some guy bets against the results given everyone wants to believe them to be true, if he is right he wins, if he is wrong, then he wins as the result is cool anyway.

He will more often be right and therefore come out on top in the long run. Seemed to make sense.

On the curvature changes, Im not sure how easy that is to predict to within a range that results in so minute a change, despite if true that minute change being huge.

burnz · 27-09-2011, 03:01 AM

in some cases light can be slowed down, earth isn't a vacumme.
where these neutrino's/leutrino's/ieutrino's pass threw objects..

fmc351 · 27-09-2011, 03:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnz

in some cases light can be slowed down, earth isn't a vacumme.
where these neutrino's/leutrino's/ieutrino's pass threw objects..

This is the sort of thing, we are talking a miniscule change in speed. Wouldnt take much to alter the result by 60 nanoseconds.

xtremerus · 27-09-2011, 01:16 PM

Get the RTA to set up a speed camera.

They will catch it speeding.

nasss92 · 27-09-2011, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Xtremerus- get the rat to set up a speed camera. They will catch It speeding

Haha that's gold.. But it dsnt have a number plate, who would they send the fine too?

**redxm** · 27-09-2011, 01:42 PM

Once upon a time it was thought that you couldnt go faster than the speed of time. It may take 500 years but I bet theres away around FTL travel.
Dear great great great great great grandson, See I told you so.......

Iggypoppin' · 27-09-2011, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redxm

Once upon a time it was thought that you couldnt go faster than the speed of time. It may take 500 years but I bet theres away around FTL travel.
Dear great great great great great grandson, See I told you so.......

Who theorized this "faster than time" thing?
Time can slow down and speed up as we have proven but I can't understand what you mean by "faster than time".

FGII-XR6 · 27-09-2011, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nasss92

Haha that's gold.. But it dsnt have a number plate, who would they send the fine too?

how many demerit points for going faster than light ?

fmc351 · 27-09-2011, 04:12 PM

Bartender: Hey, we dont serve neutrinos in here.
Two neutrinos walk into a bar.

**redxm** · 27-09-2011, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iggypoppin'

Who theorized this "faster than time" thing?
Time can slow down and speed up as we have proven but I can't understand what you mean by "faster than time".

typo. should be light. my head hurts

Iggypoppin' · 27-09-2011, 08:39 PM

Too easy!

Falc'man · 27-09-2011, 09:28 PM

Nothing new here.

bob^ · 27-09-2011, 10:21 PM

What I am having trouble getting my head around is the twins paradox.
Twin A stays on earth, Twin B travels at the speed of light for 3 months according to Twin B's clock.
When he returns to earth, everyone has aged more than 3 months except for him. Time has slowed down for twin B.
To me, 3 months is 3 months, regardless. According to the experts that is not the case/

Jack960 · 27-09-2011, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob^

What I am having trouble getting my head around is the twins paradox.
Twin A stays on earth, Twin B travels at the speed of light for 3 months according to Twin B's clock.
When he returns to earth, everyone has aged more than 3 months except for him. Time has slowed down for twin B.
To me, 3 months is 3 months, regardless. According to the experts that is not the case/

Nah that cant be true really, because it is all relative. I had a discussion about this the other day. If he is gone for three months, he will age three months and so will everyone else in the universe. Its just when you look at him from the light years away would he appear to not change.

BHDOGS · 28-09-2011, 12:55 AM

I believe its due to him travelling at the speed of light time actually slows down so 3 months to us isnt 3 months to him but a shorter period hence he hasnt aged as much

Iggypoppin' · 28-09-2011, 01:12 AM

Think of time like a wave that can bunch up and stretch out. This helps understand the twins anomoly.

hamoudy10 · 28-09-2011, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BHDOGS

I believe its due to him travelling at the speed of light time actually slows down so 3 months to us isnt 3 months to him but a shorter period hence he hasnt aged as much

This is correct. Time Dilation. It's hard to explain on words on the internet but i'll try find this site our physics teacher showed us. This is exciting, physcis thread 1 month before hsc lol

hamoudy10 · 28-09-2011, 10:33 PM

This is it. It shows a clock as a beam of light bouncing between two mirrors. The beam in the moving vehicle has to move a further distance relative to the stationary clock, so the ticks slower in the moving vehicle.
CLICKY Hit play on the first animation

Franco Cozzo · 28-09-2011, 10:46 PM

Going to be interesting if they prove this correct, books will have to be re-written, school curriculum changed, etc.

Brendo_GSUte · 28-09-2011, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob^

What I am having trouble getting my head around is the twins paradox.
Twin A stays on earth, Twin B travels at the speed of light for 3 months according to Twin B's clock.
When he returns to earth, everyone has aged more than 3 months except for him. Time has slowed down for twin B.
To me, 3 months is 3 months, regardless. According to the experts that is not the case/

Blame Einstein for this one... and its the other way round B is actually older.

Twin A stays "frozen" as light is hitting him making him exist at the speed of light. (Light is equal to Time) they are linear more or less.

So Twin B travells away from him at the speed of light, while twin B continues to age quicker than the speed of light (Light plus time)

Explained another way:
I look at a analogue clocks hands. I see the time by light hitting those hands. If i travel away from the clock at the speed of light around the world back to the clock maintaining greater than the speed of light then when i get back to the clock the hands would of appeared to have stopped. And the time i experienced while travelling at the speed of light is effectivly free.

Explained another way:
If you went quicker than light you would arrive at Point B before leaving point A and be able to see your self coming.

But time can be distorted by gravity thats been proven when 2 atomic clocks started at the equator and one went into space and came back again. the one that went into space was "younger" and if you know how an atomic clock works its a definitave answer that gravity distorts time.

Thinking about it more there may be something about the HADRON collider's location that makes it have differing gravitational pull at different parts of the particle accelerator... and i doubt it would be a perfect vacum too.

Brendo_GSUte · 28-09-2011, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hamoudy10

This is it. It shows a clock as a beam of light bouncing between two mirrors. The beam in the moving vehicle has to move a further distance relative to the stationary clock, so the ticks slower in the moving vehicle.
CLICKY Hit play on the first animation

thats a good way of explaining it! interesting too learnt something today

fmc351 · 29-09-2011, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brendo_BAXR8

Explained another way:
If you went quicker than light you would arrive at Point B before leaving point A and be able to see your self coming.

Youd also see yourself leaving and therefore could stop yourself from leaving meaning you were never there to stop yourself.

mik · 29-09-2011, 01:42 AM

yeah i believe time can change speeds, my mother inlaw comes for the day and brings her suitcase, stays for a week

.....the time drags on and on and on.....and .............oooonnnnnnnn.....................

Iggypoppin' · 29-09-2011, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fmc351

Youd also see yourself leaving and therefore could stop yourself from leaving meaning you were never there to stop yourself.

Not quite..

fmc351 · 29-09-2011, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iggypoppin'

Not quite..

Yes it would. Time would stand still in a loop. Youd be there to stop yourself, meaning you never left therefore couldnt stop yourself which means you went and stopped yourself and round and round we go.