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Old 07-04-2008, 09:38 PM   #1
buts44
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Default XR5 Unable to be started

Just a warning to everyone regarding the XR5 with keyless ignition. I was unable to start my car yesterday afternoon - absolutely nothing working when pressing the "power" button. No accessories which also meant unable to unlock the steering, windows or anything else. The Dealer promptly sent a Tow Truck this morning to pick up the car and as of late today the vehicle is still not able to be started. I was told that the battery had gone completely flat and had lost all codes etc. Apparently when the keys are in the vicinity of the vehicle, the management system polls different sensors etc in readiness for the vehicle to be started. He believes that the keys may have been in range of the vehicle and this has caused the battery to flatten. Sounds like a load of you know what to me, however they have had to order a new battery (car is 2 weeks old) and they are still trying to get the car and keys recoded. He did mention that there is some new software upgrade coming however I dont know how this relates to the problem they are explaining to me. Might know more tomorrow if and when they get the car going again.

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Old 07-04-2008, 09:55 PM   #2
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Sounds plausible, it's true that the car would be in ready mode with the keys are near by. The questions is, what is the distance? Are your keys left near the car at home or work.

I used work in the mobile phone industry and I had a guy once have a bluetooth car kit fitted by a 3rd party who just connected it straight to the battery so it would remain on constantly. His bedroom was right beside the garage where he parked the car. So the phone would stay connected to the car kit all the time and it flattened his battery in the car real quick. He only realised one day when he went to answer his phone and it went through to the car kit. He said the next day his battery was dead.

So I guess it could happen, the only option I can think of is put your keys away from your car.
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Old 07-04-2008, 11:21 PM   #3
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The software upgrade coming is to solve the issue of the cars dropping the codes and sounding the alarm, when this happens though the ignition is sent to position two so your radio actually turns on when the alarm sounds and stays on, this is happening to Mondeo's all over the world with the keyless ignition.

When this happened to mine, at 11pm one night, the car dead locked me out, could not use the physical key to get me into the car or use either remote to open it, had to be towed to the dealer... tilt sensors deactivated the alarm and locking whilst towing so when it got there it could be unlocked by key but battery was flat.

One thing to note when the battery does go flat you will need to re-program things like auto up and down on your power windows, your global open and close, and also things like your stereo presets such as EQ settings.

The car does poll for keys, but the signal is not that strong, the key needs to be basically in the car for it to work, and if a key is locked in the car then that key is disabled until the car is unlocked and started by the key that locked the car in the first place, I don't know if the key polling is active if the car is off and locked. I'll see if i can find out anymore information on that issue.
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Old 08-04-2008, 08:53 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by TheColonel
The software upgrade coming is to solve the issue of the cars dropping the codes and sounding the alarm, when this happens though the ignition is sent to position two so your radio actually turns on when the alarm sounds and stays on, this is happening to Mondeo's all over the world with the keyless ignition.

When this happened to mine, at 11pm one night, the car dead locked me out, could not use the physical key to get me into the car or use either remote to open it, had to be towed to the dealer... tilt sensors deactivated the alarm and locking whilst towing so when it got there it could be unlocked by key but battery was flat.

One thing to note when the battery does go flat you will need to re-program things like auto up and down on your power windows, your global open and close, and also things like your stereo presets such as EQ settings.

The car does poll for keys, but the signal is not that strong, the key needs to be basically in the car for it to work, and if a key is locked in the car then that key is disabled until the car is unlocked and started by the key that locked the car in the first place, I don't know if the key polling is active if the car is off and locked. I'll see if i can find out anymore information on that issue.
Thanks everyone for the advice, got the car back tonight and they are saying that they think it was just a dud battery. It took them 7.5 hours to get the car going again after the flat battery. I am still sceptical on the flat battery syndrome, just doesnt seem to make sense that the battery went flat so quick when I still had plenty of juice to run headlights, stereo, the initial Human Interface Screen etc in the car. Just glad its back and have to keep an eye on it over the coming weeks.
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Old 08-04-2008, 09:40 PM   #5
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Well it happened to me on the weekend. Friggin alarm started going of, radio was on window wipers going and the car lights were on. Nothing i did would open the bastard. I tried the remote and the actual key but it just wouldnt open. Worst of all it was ****ing down with rain so i got drenched. I thought it may be the remote so i had to catch the cab home to get the spare and the come back. Well that did bugger all.

I thought i would ring the car dealer and they never heard of such a thing happening. They offered to send a road side assistance guy out. 1 hour wait, all soaked and freesing he finally rocked up. i told him the problem. He had to use a pair of pliers on the key to open the door. I then tried to start it and it was completely dead. he tried charging the battery and did not work. He added an additional battery to get the car to charge but that also didnt help.

After all that he decided that all he had left to do is remove the battery and replace it with another and guess what it worked. The battery was cactus.

Reading the above Im starting worry now that its the car that actually caused the battery to cark it. What if it happens again and my 4 month old is in the car. Now i need to carry a pair of pliers with me and maybe a brick (ha ha) to smash the window.

If anyone finds out some more news please keep us updated.

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Old 08-04-2008, 10:19 PM   #6
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Ok, There are two ways of temporary fixing this...

1. Disconnect battery then reconnect after a few minutes

2. Bypass the R4 relais located in the engine compartment.Connect the car to IDS and reset all codes...

So taking a battery in and replacing may not have been long enough for the joy to return to life... and since the thing is not that easy to open when it's in that state with a key, you can't really get into the sucker to pop the bonnet anyways to try and disconnect the battery... and there is no known way to open it externally... I'm keeping an eye out on the news of the update being released...
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Old 09-04-2008, 02:40 PM   #7
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Man, starting to think that I am glade I still have a key. In my opinion, they should still have a key as a back up. Even if you never have to use it. It would make sense to me anyway.
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Old 09-04-2008, 05:48 PM   #8
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We do have a key as a backup to enter the car, it's inside the key fob.

Once you're inside you lift off the ignition blank cover and insert the whole key fob into a slot to start the car.

Doesn't help in this situation when the battery is flat.
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Old 24-04-2008, 07:14 PM   #9
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Default Ignition problems

I took delivery of my xr5 at the end of Feb 08 and after 3000k's of enjoyment the keyless ignition failed 5pm Friday 4th April evening 120k from home.

The dealer had no quick fix so $300 of towing costs later (Even after the free 50k from NRMA) and the car back at the dealer where I was told that the replacement ignition module was not in Australia and could take 3 weeks to source. Apparently the current stock could not be trusted.

I finally got a call today to say it was fixed.

Maybe you should all be hassling the dealers for replacements if the current module is thought to be dodgy.

A note of caution - if the ignition fails the electronic steering lock cannot be disengaged. I will be parking with wheels straight from now on!!!!!!!!

Other than the above it is a great motor, good to get back to euro controls after the last 4 years in Falcons with the controls on the wrong side of the wheel. The headlight dimmer switch is a Volvo thing I think as my last car in the UK was a V40 with the same mechanism.
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Old 24-04-2008, 08:06 PM   #10
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each to their own but I happen to think that having the turn signal on the left in a manual car with rhd is a painintheass! and that dipper switch is just as bad.
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Old 24-04-2008, 09:02 PM   #11
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No use having xr5 control modules replaced as it's a software issue and the new unit will have the same issues until ford rectify their software issues for this
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Old 24-04-2008, 10:00 PM   #12
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Default Modules

My XR5 went in for 3000k service and its towbar on monday after having the vehicle fail to start twice in the first 3000k's. Had to have it towed once as previously stated and the second time, the car came good just as the tow truck arrived.

Dealer send on monday that they are still waiting on the upgrade and should be here in the next month or so.

Look forward to the day as my wife has now refused to drive the car as she is afraid she will get stuck somewhere.
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Old 24-04-2008, 10:11 PM   #13
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Same issue here with the good lady, didn't want a manual and now worried that it will fail to start on Woolies car park.

At least I will avoid trolley damage!!!!!!!!
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Old 25-04-2008, 07:34 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulie0735
each to their own but I happen to think that having the turn signal on the left in a manual car with rhd is a painintheass! and that dipper switch is just as bad.
Our Mondeo is the first car I have driven in 48 years with the indicator lever on the left yet I'm finding it the 'natural' side for me. Right from day one I have had no problem with it - only hitting the right-hand lever a couple of times.

Yet when I drive my Laser now (which is most of the time - the Mondeo is my wife's car), I quite often hit the left-side lever.

(Our Mondeo is an auto.)
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Old 25-04-2008, 08:44 AM   #15
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[QUOTE=ian b] the keyless ignition failed




Oh great, something to look forward to, no doubt it will happen at the worse time. So far (touch wood) no issues yet (hope I haven't just jinxed myself though).
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Old 27-04-2008, 08:07 PM   #16
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Just had my second experience with this fault. The first time, I was parked near the automatic sliding doors of a local grocery store. Hence I figured my fob was being jammed and the problem went away as soon as I moved away from the offending signal. Today, it happened a 2nd time...and I was parked in my driveway!!! I called my salesman for lack of anyone else and he came around to check it out so that he could better assist the service dept on Monday morning. I won't know whats wrong until tomorrow at least, but it's a little disheartening to sit in your brand new car and not be able to do ANYTHING!!! It still looks damn good though....for a $48,000 paper weight!:P
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Old 27-04-2008, 08:42 PM   #17
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but it's a little disheartening to sit in your brand new car and not be able to do ANYTHING!!!
I have been following this thread I think the whole deal on this issue is just totally wrong, if Ford cant come up with a fix they should be supplying you guy's with another car to drive until they do.
Maybe a collective letter to Ford HQ seeking a quicker response to this problem.
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Old 27-04-2008, 08:42 PM   #18
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bugger, I think Ford should still put a normal ignition in the XR5 just in case. You don't have to use it unless things like this happen. They need to do something about it. I wonder if they can retro fit them for you guys.
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Old 28-04-2008, 12:28 PM   #19
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Same thing has happened to me....with the car only 5 days old - completely dead.

Tow truck on it's way...
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Old 28-04-2008, 09:39 PM   #20
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When my problem arose I got a loan Focus from the dealer, until they realiesed I was doing 1000k per week, then they arranged a loan Fairmont for the next two weeks through Ford CRC.

If you call 13FORD with the problem they give you a case number. The dealer can then use this to arrange for the loan car.

Mine has been back 4 days now with no problems other than my heart in my mouth each time I press the "lack of power" button.

If enough people ring Ford CRC then the message should get through.

Also chase Ford for the tow charges under the warranty.

Ian
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Old 30-08-2008, 08:37 AM   #21
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My problem started Thursday morning with the 'No Key Detected' message from both sets of keys & the steering lock option going no better.
After logging the call with CRC & stuffing around between which dealer was going to get the car, it was 'fixed' by a software upgrade Thursday evening.
Having used the car for work on Friday, I'm still having problems; one start with the key in the column, one total non-start with no error messages, nothing; a quick call to the Dealer who 'repaired' it & some banging in the hatch got me home. Back to the dealer first thing Monday.
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Old 30-08-2008, 11:47 AM   #22
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My Mondeo died in the showroom when I went to pickup the car.
I thought it was the battery dying on me, and they managed to restart it after a long charge with a second booster pack. On the 2nd drive, all my warning lights came up, but the car drove okay (albeit a bit sluggish in hindsight). After that, I've not had any issues (thank God!).

I'll be another owner asking for software updates at my 3000km "inspection".
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Old 30-08-2008, 12:46 PM   #23
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Maybe the battery is supplied by Aldi I start with replacing it with a deep cycle one interesting if someone measures the current flow with the car in normal park mode with everything turned off don't forget most equipment especially electronic security devices or chips controlling management system will not operate below a certain voltage to protect their circuits as with digital cameras/laptops etc even my DSLR camera pack it in and I believe it was the cold snap we had in Sydney all 3 batteries dead

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Old 30-08-2008, 08:54 PM   #24
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Surely Ford have a fix for this problem by now?
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Old 31-08-2008, 07:58 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apstar
Maybe the battery is supplied by Aldi I start with replacing it with a deep cycle one interesting if someone measures the current flow with the car in normal park mode with everything turned off don't forget most equipment especially electronic security devices or chips controlling management system will not operate below a certain voltage to protect their circuits as with digital cameras/laptops etc even my DSLR camera pack it in and I believe it was the cold snap we had in Sydney all 3 batteries dead

apstar
Generally speaking deep cycle batteries are not designed for 'cranking' duty so i would not be advising the use of these in cars. Having said that they do have their advantages and the turbo I5 is fairly low compression so should be ok.
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Old 31-08-2008, 01:45 PM   #26
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You can buy optima deep cycles with good cranking amps now.

But they are very expensive.
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Old 04-09-2008, 07:11 PM   #27
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OK hopefully the end of the saga; got the car back today, after having it towed to the dealer first thing Monday. 3 control units (over $1000 each, all faulty), software upgrade & a key fob ($300+) later, it appears to be sorted.
Apparently the techies assigned from Melbourne are recommending the keyless system be dropped from the next facelift.
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Old 04-09-2008, 07:37 PM   #28
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Hi all sorry to hear about start problems. : Get on to customer service centre the more is better. If this was a fpv falcon could have been fixed by now. As it sounds like battery not good quality and lock plus run module are playing up.
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Old 04-09-2008, 10:48 PM   #29
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Wonder if jump starting the car caused the damage to the modules!!

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Old 06-09-2008, 09:43 AM   #30
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My problems had nothing to do with battery or jump starting.
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